好的，这是我对访谈内容的中文翻译： **访谈记录：挪威财富基金 CEO 尼古拉·坦扬对话 ASML CEO 克里斯托夫·福克** ASML 是一家生产光刻系统的关键公司，这些系统用于制造计算机芯片。这些系统对于医疗保健、电动汽车、通信和国防等各个领域的进步至关重要。 福克解释说，ASML 的光刻系统将电子电路印刷到芯片上。他们是 EUV（极紫外）光刻机的唯一生产商，该光刻机使用波长极短的光（13.5 纳米）来印刷更小的特征。创建 EUV 光的困难在于产生足够的能量来工业化该工具。ASML 花费了 20 多年的时间开发这项技术。为了产生 EUV 光，他们每秒用高功率 CO2 激光轰击一个微小的锡滴 50,000 次，每次锡滴轰击三次以优化光输出。这些机器的尺寸相当于一辆双层巴士，需要七架飞机和 50 辆卡车才能运输。这种尺寸是由于需要复杂的光学器件在真空中引导光线，以便将图像印刷到晶圆上。 讨论涉及摩尔定律，该定律认为芯片上的晶体管密度每两年翻一番。虽然有人声称摩尔定律已死，但福克认为它仍然有效，并且对于提供性能（尤其是对于人工智能）至关重要。人工智能正在推动需求的加速增长，一些人工智能开发者希望每两年晶体管密度增加 16 倍。他预计在创新的推动下，这一发展将至少持续 20 年。 开发 EUV 技术耗资超过 60 亿美元，历时超过 15 年。ASML 通过优先考虑他们认为对行业正确的事情来培养长期思维。他们投资 EUV 是因为他们认为它是唯一可扩展的，能够同时提供分辨率和生产力的技术。他们深信该行业需要它，因此他们要求客户共同投资。这种通过扩展摩尔定律来为行业进步做出贡献的信念是其核心价值观。 ASML 还与蔡司在光学方面密切合作。这种关系对于他们的成功至关重要，因为两家公司都专注于各自的优势，并培养一种相互挑战的文化。 关于人工智能，福克坚信它对人类的潜力。他预见到人工智能将通过利用产品开发和使用中产生的大量数据来加速研发。这需要越来越复杂的模型和高计算能力，为英伟达、AMD、台积电、英特尔和三星等公司创造了巨大的机会。他认为人工智能正在改变行业，将重点从移动转向人工智能，并推动整个行业路线图的改变。 美国和中国之间的地缘政治紧张局势带来了挑战。以前开放合作的时代已经转向脱钩。这可能会增加成本，减缓创新，并扰乱行业的平衡。虽然中国无法获得 EUV，导致其在先进逻辑方面大大落后，但他希望能够找到更好的政治解决方案来实现全球合作。台湾在全球供应链中的作用也存在风险，鉴于其地缘政治重要性。 福克认为芯片法案对于启动美国、日本、英国和韩国的活动和投资很有用，但结构性成本竞争力对于该行业至关重要。他强调了灵活性、获得资本、基础设施和负担得起的能源的重要性。 他还讨论了欧洲缺乏大型科技公司的问题，将其归因于灵活性、成本、获得资本和能源价格等问题。他强调需要政治意愿来重新投资未来并创造机会。 ASML 的总部位于荷兰费尔德霍芬，是飞利浦创新中心的遗产。该公司已经建立了一个强大的生态系统，拥有重要的供应商。他将 ASML 的文化描述为非政治性的，员工专注于做对公司正确的事情。这种文化鼓励公开辩论，以推动更好的决策。 福克认为，良好领导的关键在于谦逊、真实、内容和专注于简化。他通过与工程师、运营人员、销售人员、客户和供应商的持续互动来保持脚踏实地。他强调讲故事的重要性，以便简单地解释复杂的主题并激发行动。福克的个人动力来自于解决问题和与人交流。他非常享受他的工作，没有一天是无聊的。 他建议年轻人专注于寻找他们真正喜欢并且擅长的事情。他强调，成功和成就感来自于追求激情，而不是追逐 CEO 等头衔。这有助于个人成长，产生积极影响，并在自己的努力中获得真正的兴奋。要避免压力，因为它会影响良好的决策。

This is a transcript of an interview with Christoph Fokke, the CEO of ASML, by Nicola Tangyan, CEO of the Norwegian Song of Wealth Fund. ASML is a critical company that produces lithography systems used to make computer chips. These systems are fundamental to advancements in various fields like healthcare, electric vehicles, communications, and defense. Fokke explains that ASML's lithography systems print electronic circuits onto chips. They are the sole producer of EUV (Extreme Ultraviolet) lithography printers, which use light with a very short wavelength (13.5 nanometers) to print smaller features. The difficulty in creating EUV light lies in generating enough power to industrialize the tool. ASML has spent over 20 years developing the technology. To create EUV light, they hit a tiny tin droplet with a high-powered CO2 laser 50,000 times per second, hitting it three times for each droplet to optimize the light output. The machines are the size of a double-decker bus and require seven planes and 50 trucks to transport. This size is due to the complex optics needed to guide the light in a vacuum to print the image on the wafer. The discussion touches on Moore's Law, which posits that the density of transistors on a chip doubles every two years. While some claim Moore's Law is dead, Fokke believes it's still in effect and is crucial for delivering performance, especially for AI. AI is driving an acceleration in demand, with some AI developers wanting a 16-fold increase in transistor density every two years. He anticipates this development to continue for at least another 20 years, driven by innovation. Developing the EUV technology required over $6 billion and more than 15 years. ASML cultivates a long-term mindset by prioritizing what they believe is right for the industry. They invested in EUV because they saw it as the only scalable technology for providing both resolution and productivity. They were so convinced that the industry would need it that they asked customers to co-invest. This belief in contributing to the industry's advancement by extending Moore's Law is a core value. ASML also collaborates closely with Zeiss on optics. This relationship is crucial for their success, as both companies focus on their respective strengths and foster a culture of challenging each other. Regarding AI, Fokke is a firm believer in its potential for humanity. He foresees AI accelerating R&D by leveraging the vast amounts of data generated in their product development and usage. This requires increasingly complex models and high computing power, creating a significant opportunity for companies like Nvidia, AMD, TSMC, Intel, and Samsung. He believes AI is changing the industry, shifting the focus from mobile to AI and driving changes in roadmaps across the industry. The geopolitical tensions between the US and China pose challenges. The previous era of open collaboration has shifted towards decoupling. This can increase costs, slow down innovation, and disrupt the industry's balance. While China lacks access to EUV, putting them significantly behind in advanced logic, he hopes for better political solutions for global collaboration. Taiwan's role in the supply chain also presents risks, given its geopolitical importance. Fokke sees that the Chip Acts are useful for kickstarting activity and investment in US, Japan, UK and South Korea, but structural cost competitiveness is critical for the industry. He emphasizes the importance of flexibility, access to capital, infrastructure, and affordable energy. He also discusses the lack of major technology companies in Europe, attributing it to issues like flexibility, cost, access to capital, and energy prices. He emphasizes the need for political will to reinvest in the future and create opportunities. ASML's location in Veldhoven, Netherlands, is a legacy of Philips' innovation hub. The company has fostered a strong ecosystem with critical suppliers. He describes ASML's culture as non-political, with employees focused on doing what's right for the company. The culture encourages open debate to drive better decisions. Fokke believes the key to good leadership is humbleness, authenticity, content, and a focus on simplifying. He remains grounded by continuous engagement with engineers, operations, sales, customers, and suppliers. He emphasizes the importance of storytelling to explain complex topics simply and inspire action. Fokke is personally driven by solving problems and connecting with people. He genuinely enjoys his work, and there has been not one boring day. He advises young people to focus on finding something they genuinely enjoy and excel at. He emphasizes that success and fulfillment stem from pursuing passions, not chasing titles like CEO. This allows for personal growth, positive impact, and genuine excitement in one’s endeavors. Stress is to be avoided as it clouds good decision-making.