Elon Musk | LIVE Podcast | In Good Company | Norges Bank Investment Management

Hi everyone and big thanks for tanking the time Elon you know we've been trying to get you on the podcast since we started it two years ago so we are super pleased that we that we have you on and indeed on your ex platform how cool. Yeah, it's pretty cool yeah I mean you have like lots of people from all around the world simultaneously to effectively a real time podcast and which works pretty well. So we have so much to talk about. Love to kick off with with AI. Now what's your take on where we are in the AI race just now. There's so much happening in the AI is the fastest advancing technology that I've ever seen of any kind and I've seen a lot of technology. You're barely a week goes by without some new announcement. And if you look at the amount of AI hardware the computers coming online that are dedicated to AI that is increasing what looks like, at least by a factor of 10 every year if not every six to nine months.

大家好，非常感谢大家抽出时间。埃隆，自从我们两年前开始播客节目以来，我们一直在努力邀请你参加节目，所以我们非常高兴能够邀请到你加入，并且还在你的ex平台上。这太酷了。是的，确实很酷。我是说，你可以同时听到来自世界各地很多人的真实时播客，效果相当不错。我们有很多话题要讨论。很想从人工智能方面开始。你对目前人工智能竞赛的发展情况有什么看法？人工智能领域发展迅猛，是我见过的任何技术中发展最快的。我见过很多技术。每周都有新的进展宣布，而且如果你看看AI硬件电脑的数量，专门用于人工智能的，看起来至少每年都在以10倍的速度增长，如果不是每六到九个月。

So when you combine the hardware coming online really order of magnitude increase every, you know, call it at least every nine months. And many, many software breakthroughs. If you look at that that curve it looks insane so I think we'll. My guess is that we also will have AI that is more than any, any one human. Probably to around the end of next year. And then, I, the total amount of sort of sentient compute of AI I think will probably exceed all humans in five years. And what is that what is the race about just now is it algorithm is a people is it computing power what is it about just now is it the supply of chips.

所以当你把硬件联网并且每九个月至少增长一个数量级，那么会发生很多的软件突破。如果你看看那个曲线，看起来简直不可思议，所以我认为我们会有超过任何一个人类的人工智能。可能在明年底左右。然后，我认为在五年内，人工智能的总计算量可能会超过所有人类。现在这场竞赛是关于算法、人才还是计算能力，现在是关于什么，是芯片的供应。

Just what is it. Yeah last year was a chip constrained. And the hardware deployment to break it down to the three areas of people data and hardware. Last year it was about a shift supply who could not get enough. Nvidia chips particularly. This year is starting to transition to a voltage transformer supply. So actually getting up voltage transformers. Put in place. So my sort of very niche joke is transformers for transformers because a lot of the AI that's run is called a transformer. So you need transformers to run transformers. And then next in the. If you look out a year or two or certainly three years, it's just electricity availability. So that's the thought those constraints in the hardware side.

这到底是什么意思呢？是的，去年是受芯片限制的一年。硬件部署可以分解为人、数据和硬件三个方面。去年的重点在于供应转变，因为供应商无法获得足够的产品，尤其是英伟达芯片。今年开始转向电压变压器供应。实际上是在安装电压变压器。所以我想到了一个很有特色的笑话，就是“变压器供变压器”，因为很多运行AI的设备被称为变压器。所以你需要变压器来运行变压器。再往后看一两年，甚至三年，就是电力的供应问题。这是硬件方面的约束想法。

So many of the small world smartest people are doing. AI people that would have done physics before in fact, or had have done physics, for example, have moved into AI. Because it's just the fastest moving field. So we're seeing a lot of the best talents, a lot of the smartest humans going into AI. And then we see along with that algorithmic breakthroughs. And then then you start hitting the wall with the data problem. So the, you know, you can fit all books ever written. Just the text, the text in compressed form on one hard drive. Or the call one one computer. So when you're looking at like to build tokens to train on. And you can still think of like all the books ever written in every in all languages by all humans. Sounds like a lot. It's certainly is far more than any one human could ever read. It actually is a small number of training tokens. It's just not enough. So then you have to start having to look at all the videos that are created. You know, all the podcasts, all the everything. And you start even running out of data there. Well, hopefully they hopefully they will include this podcast. Definitely will include this podcast.

世界上许多最聪明的人都在从事人工智能工作。实际上，以前可能从事物理学的AI专家们已经转向了人工智能领域，因为这是发展最快的领域。我们看到许多最优秀的人才，许多最聪明的人都进入了人工智能领域。随之而来的是算法突破。但是，接着就会遇到数据问题。你知道，你可以将所有书籍都压缩为文本，存储在一块硬盘上，这是可行的。或者说在一台计算机上。因此，当你想要建立用于训练的令牌时，你可能会考虑所有语言中所有人类创作的所有书籍。听起来很多，肯定超过任何一个人能读完的数量。但实际上，这只是一小部分训练数据。这是不够的。所以你需要开始查看所有生成的视频，所有的播客，所有的内容。甚至在那里你也开始面临数据短缺。希望他们会包含这个播客。肯定会包含的。

What's the biggest challenge you have with with X AI? Well, that's still relatively new. So it's not a, you know. Like the learning factor right now is just training our. Grock version to model, which should be, we think better than. GPD for. And that's where we're hoping to complete that in May. So that's that's training right now. So it's just really, we're. Just trying to get enough GPUs online to train it fast enough to. Get that done in May, which I think it probably will happen. So then. And that's with. Roughly 20,000 H 100s. And doing, I think very efficient training.

你在使用X人工智能时遇到的最大挑战是什么？嗯，这还是比较新的。所以不是一个，你知道的。现在最大的挑战就是训练我们的Grok版本模型，我们认为它应该比GPD好。我们希望在五月份完成这个训练。所以目前就是在进行训练。我们只是尽力将足够多的GPU在线上训练，以便在五月完成工作，我想这可能会发生。所以目前大约有20,000个H 100s，而且我认为训练效率非常高。

Then the next step would be. For Grock three, which would be, I guess. G55 or beyond. Would, you know, requires a hundred thousand. Nvidia H 100s training coherently. So that's. You know, a half order of magnitude, basically more training. And then you really start to have running into this data problem where you. You have to either create synthetic data or use real world video. So those are the two sources of kind of like unlimited data. Synthetic data. And real world video, which I should say Tesla has a pretty big advantage in real world video. Because it has by far the most real world video of anyone. Yeah, you've got a huge library.

然后下一步就是。对于Grock三来说，我猜应该是G55或更高。需要一百万次的Nvidia H100的训练。所以基本上需要多一半数量的训练。然后你就会开始遇到数据问题，你要么创造合成数据，要么使用真实世界的视频。所以这两种来源就是无限数据的来源。合成数据和真实世界的视频，我应该说特斯拉在真实世界的视频方面有很大的优势。因为它拥有迄今为止大部分真实世界的视频。是的，你拥有一个庞大的库。

So when do you think, so when do you think we'll see proper AGI. Well, this is how you define a GI. If you find a GI as smart as those miles human, I think it's. Probably any next year. Like within two years. But with that stuff, the still. It's still a pretty big leap beyond that to say smarter than the machine augmented human collective. So like is it smarter than all humans working together. Who are also using computers to augment their output. And that that I think is probably five years away. But when we look at it is, is to try to assess. Like roughly what is the ratio of digital to biological compute. Last question on on a new thoughts on regulation and how we should be structured. Well, I think we probably do need some sort of regulatory authority to look at the safety of a I just as we have. Regulatory authorities and other arenas to. You know, oversea aircraft and. The safety of aircraft and. Cars and other things, you know, medication. So. Another area which AI is progressing is fast. It's faster than probably any regulatory agency can keep up with. But I do have a comment on what I think is very important for. Achieving safe AI, which is that it's very important to train the ad to be as truthful as possible. And not to. Yeah, just to be as truthful as possible. I think you can get some very dangerous things when you program an AI to be politically correct. Thing that things that may seem. Relatively innocuous now, but will not be so in the future if has immense power. You can take the Google Gemini example where it refused to publish it to produce a picture of George Washington as a white man. And any in fact any historical figure would automatically be made diverse. Because it's been programmed to insist on diversity, which sounds. You know, perhaps OK at first, but not if the AI has so much power that it can actually enforce diversity and decide there's too many of one kind of people or too many of one sex and kill off. And so the diversity number is what is programmed to believe is correct. But I don't think this will be sorted out in the next version. No, no, they'll make it more subtle. OK, unless obvious, but it will still be there. OK, well, we'll see. But where is China? Where is China now in our relative for us? I don't know exactly what China is. Except there are a lot of very smart people in China and they. It won't be. There won't be far behind the rest of the world or far behind the US. I mean, the air right now is. Very concentrated in San Francisco and London. And then. You know, there's this. You know, a lot happening in China, but I don't have insight into what they're doing. Except that they were I'm confident they will not be far behind what is developed in the West. Yeah. So. But but but mark my words. If if we do not program an AI to be as truthful as possible. That that is where it will go. All right, that is where the danger lies. And. And.

你认为我们什么时候会看到真正的人工智能呢？嗯，这取决于你如何定义智能。如果你认为智能和普通人一样聪明，那我认为可能是明年或者两年内。但距离比机器增强合成人类更聪明仍有一大步要迈过去。比如说，它是否比所有一起工作的人类更聪明，他们也在使用电脑增强产出。我认为这可能需要五年时间。当我们尝试评估时，想知道数字和生物计算的比例是多少。在监管和结构上有新想法吗？我认为我们可能需要某种监管机构来关注人工智能的安全，就像我们在其他领域管理飞机、汽车以及药物安全一样。人工智能的进展速度可能比任何监管机构都要快。但我认为对于实现安全的人工智能很重要的一点是，训练人工智能尽可能真实，而不是仅仅追求政治正确。如果将人工智能编程为追求多样性，那可能会导致一些危险的问题。为了安全起见，我认为必须非常小心处理这一点。至于中国在这方面的发展，我不太清楚，但我相信他们不会落后于西方世界。总之，要小心不要让人工智能变得不真实，这才是真正的危险所在。

Moving moving back here moving to to Tesla. Is is the EV conversion now going slower than you had expected? Just where is the speed of commercial relative to your expectations? I think it's going quite fast, actually, especially Norway. Absolutely. Well, it's pretty much all there is is your Tesla's. Yeah, there's a lot of Tesla's noise crazy. I want to get in like staying away for the support of electric vehicles. So much appreciated. So. I think it's. We will. That electric that all vehicles will go fully electric. It's only a matter of time. That includes aircraft ultimately and boats. Obviously trains.

搬回这里，搬到特斯拉那里去。电动车转型现在比你预期的要慢吗？商业速度相对于你的预期在哪里？我觉得实际上速度相当快，尤其是挪威。绝对。嗯，基本上特斯拉是唯一的选择。是的，特斯拉的数量简直疯狂。我想支持电动车的发展。非常感激。我认为会的。所有车辆最终都会变成电动的。这只是时间问题。包括最终飞机和船只。显然也包括火车。

The only thing that is, I don't think it'd be difficult to, or you can't really make it electric is rockets because you need. You can't get away from having to expel mass. You know, sort of Newton's dead. But, but all cause will be electric. It's only a matter of time and we'll look back on. Combustion cause in the same way that we look at back on. And then we'll look back on the last dimensions. That, that I was, it was inevitable that there would be. Internal combustion cars and that is just as inevitable that all cars will go electric. And. There will be some evidence, you know, so that can be a completely. Straight up line, there will be some. Evan flow in how. How far electric cars go, but that. But the ultimate. Victory electric cars is inevitable. And I think the sooner we get there, the better.

唯一不可能电动化的事物，我认为是火箭，因为你需要。你无法摆脱需要排放质量的问题。你知道，这是牛顿的法则。但是，所有车辆都将电动化。只是一个时间问题，我们会回首。就像我们回首内燃机汽车一样，然后我们会回首过去的维度。我想说，内燃机汽车的出现是不可避免的，所有汽车变为电动化同样不可避免。会有一些证据，这不可能是一条直线，会有一些曲折。电动汽车走多远，但是最终胜利属于电动汽车，这是不可避免的。我认为我们尽早实现这一点，越好。

Yeah. How do you see the Chinese competition now? We generally find that the companies in China are the most competitive in the world. And so me in. Electric vehicles or cars in general, the Chinese car companies are by far the most competitive. Yeah, that's where we find the most toughest, toughest competitive, competitive challenges. That they make great cars and they work very hard. So when you write in one of the Chinese cars, what do you think? I mean, you're an engineer. You know, what about it? What do you, what do you think? I haven't written it. I have not written in one lately, but. Because they're not all available here. You know, in the US, very, very few are available in the US. Some are available in Europe. But from what my team tells me, they are very good.

是的。你现在怎么看待中国的竞争？我们通常认为中国公司是全球竞争力最强的。特别是在电动汽车或汽车领域，中国汽车公司无疑是最有竞争力的。是的，我们发现中国是我们面临最艰巨竞争挑战的地方。他们生产出色的汽车，非常努力工作。那么，当你坐在中国汽车上时，你会怎么想呢？我是说，作为一名工程师，你会怎么看待它？我最近还没有坐过。因为这里并没有所有型号。在美国，只有极少的中国汽车销售。一些在欧洲有销售。但是根据我的团队告诉我的，它们非常优秀。

Moving moving out out in space. What, what would it take to be self sufficient at Mars? To be self sufficient Mars, it's really about the total tonnage that is delivered to the surface of Mars. So you can say like, well. I think it's probably on the order of a million tons, maybe, maybe more, but somewhere between probably a million tons. And 10 million tons are needed to make Mars and self sufficient. And how many rockets is that? Well, I gave a presentation on this recently. If you look at my recent space X talk, but. If you, if you have 100, it's really. If you have 100 tons per flight, you need 10,000 flights.

在太空中移动出去。在火星要自给自足需要什么？要在火星实现自给自足，实际上关键在于向火星表面运送的总吨位。可以说，可能需要一百万吨，也许更多，但大概在一百万吨到一千万吨之间。那需要多少火箭？我最近有过关于这个问题的演讲。如果你看过我最近的SpaceX演讲，可以了解更多。如果每次航行可以携带一百吨，那么需要一万次航行。

To get to a million, a million tons. And that's 100 times landed to the surface of Mars. So in order to get 100 times landed to the surface of Mars, you need 500 times that number in Earth orbit. So we do a lot of orbital refilling. So launching sort of rockets, tank or ships over and over again that that would replenish the propellant of the ships that will go to Mars. And then you need roughly a little bit of 10,000 of them to get to a million tons. And, but we, we plan to do that. That's, that's what we think we can get that done within 20 years. Really. So when you think, so when you think we'll be there for the first time. First, first, well, the first.

要达到100万吨，需要100倍的质量落在火星表面上。所以为了让100倍的质量落在火星表面上，你需要在地球轨道上有500倍数量的物体。所以我们要进行大量轨道加注。就是不断地发射火箭、油箱或船只，来补充前往火星的船只的推进剂。然后你大约需要10,000艘这样的船只来达到100万吨。但是我们打算做到。我们认为我们可以在20年内完成。真的。所以你认为，第一次我们会什么时候到达那里。第一次，首次。

Starship that will land on Mars, which obviously would not have people at first. I think it's probably within about five years. And then it would probably launch several ships and just. Confirm that they can land. Okay, on Mars. We'll also be doing the moon simultaneously with that so go taking. I think we'll get people back to the moon, I should say within five years, and we'll get uncrewed ships landed on Mars than five years. And, and then we'll be building up the production rate and approving the design of the booster in the ship. So, so the first people on Mars, I think within seven years or so seven to nine years. And from from there we need to rapidly increase.

星际飞船将降落在火星，显然起初不会有人。我认为可能在大约五年内实现。然后可能会发射几艘飞船，确认它们能否成功着陆。好的，在前往火星的同时，我们也将进行月球探索。我认为我们会在五年内将人类带回月球，并在五年内将无人飞船着陆在火星上。之后，我们将加快生产速度，并改进火箭发射器和太空飞船的设计。所以，我认为头批登陆火星的人类将在七年左右，或者七到九年内抵达。从那里开始，我们需要迅速增加。

We need massive numbers of. Shifts going and earth and Mars only. In the same quadrant of the solar system. Roughly for six months every two years, or at least. It's only possible to really transfer efficiently. From earth to Mars. I say every six months but really there's about a couple months where it's ideal. Every 26 months. So every two years that you would see a fleet depart Mars, I think required a spectacular thing to see. A thousand ships to part from Mars. All the ones like battle, start galactic.

我们需要大规模的航天飞行。只有在地球和火星之间进行。在太阳系的同一象限。大致每两年进行六个月，或者至少如此。只有真正高效的实际转移才可能。从地球到火星。我说每六个月，但实际上有大约两个月是最理想的。每26个月。所以每两年你会看到一个舰队离开火星，我认为这是一个壮观的景象。一千艘船要离开火星。所有这些都像战斗，开始银河系的流星。

What kind of new technology we need before we'll be self sufficient. Actually, I think we have all the tech we already know all the technology that's necessary for that. It just needs to be just need to build. So no new physics is needed for this. Why is it so important for you. I think it's important for consciousness in general. So if we're sick. I maximize the last bit of consciousness. Then being a multi planet species will result in a much longer. Existence of consciousness consciousness that if we are one planet. If you're on one planet, we're simply fighting our time until. There's eventually a calamity. It could be soon. It could be a long time. But eventually something will happen. It could be global, though, in nuclear war. It could be simply that civilization really subsides. Our civilization may not die with a bag and may die with a whimper. Just gradually. Falling into obsolescence.

我们在实现自给自足之前需要什么样的新技术？实际上，我认为我们已经掌握了所有必要的技术。我们只需要开始建造。所以这并不需要新的物理学知识。为什么这对你来说如此重要？我认为这对整体意识来说很重要。所以如果我们很脆弱，我要尽可能地利用最后一点意识。而成为一个多星球物种将导致意识存在更长时间。如果我们只在一个星球上，那么我们只是在等待灾难的发生。灾难可能很快就会发生，也可能很久以后。但最终一定会发生。可能会是全球性的，比如核战争。也可能只是文明逐渐消失。我们的文明可能不会以轰轰烈烈的方式消亡，而是慢慢地，渐渐地沦为过时。

But if we're a multi planet species, then we've got two planets. And they can support each other. And we can go beyond two planets ultimately to the moons of Jupiter to the. Beyond to the outer parts of the solar system and ultimately to other star systems. So this tiny, this tiny candle of consciousness that we have. In this past darkness can be extended. And amplified and we're just far more likely to. I survive as for consciousness survive. If we are multi planet species. You don't think it'd be better to use all these resources and try to sort out the earth. Well, just to put this into perspective, the amount of resources I'm talking about for making life multi planetary will be less than 1% of all resources on earth. So really can think of it as resource allocation. Do you think it's worth spending half a percent of earth resources to ensure that we have redundancy and consciousness.

但是，如果我们是一个多星球物种，那么我们就拥有了两个星球。它们可以互相支持。最终我们可以继续超越两个星球，前往木星的卫星。甚至超越太阳系的外部，最终到达其他恒星系统。因此，我们所拥有的这微弱的意识之光，在这过去的黑暗中可以延伸和放大。我们更有可能存活，意识也更有可能存活，如果我们是一个多星球物种。你不觉得更好地利用这些资源来解决地球的问题吗？嗯，让我来解释一下，我谈到的用于让生命多元化的资源量不到地球上所有资源的1%。所以我们真的可以把它看作是资源分配。你觉得值得花费地球资源的半个百分点来确保我们拥有备份和意识吗？

And that we extend consciousness beyond Mars to other planets to tomorrow's another planets and ultimately other star systems. And then also taking to account the fact that there are certain inevitably there's some things we simply cannot avoid on earth. Like is it within your power mind to stop World War three. I don't think so. Oh, if it happens. And if we have global revenue of the warfare, our technology level will drop to the stone age. And we remain ever five. And then there are we maybe get you may get hit like like a comment, like the dinosaurs. And, you know, if the dinosaurs has spaceships they probably still be around. So this and then if you wait long enough the earth that the sun will continue to expand and eventually engulf earth and destroy it and destroy all life.

我们要将意识延伸到火星之外的其他行星，延伸到明天的其他行星，最终延伸到其他星系。同时我们也要考虑到在地球上有一些不可避免的事情。例如，你是否有能力阻止第三次世界大战？我认为不可能。如果发生了，如果我们有全球范围的战争，我们的科技水平将会退回到石器时代。我们会永远留在五步之后。还有可能会像恐龙那样被撞击，就像恐龙灭绝一样。而且，如果恐龙有宇宙飞船，它们可能还存在着。再等待足够长时间，太阳会继续膨胀，并最终吞噬地球，摧毁所有生命。

So just to give it an amount and a certain amount of time, no matter what you do on earth, no matter how careful you are. Both will life or life on earth will die. That will happen is a certainty. Let's zoom in out. X Twitter. Yeah. What is your vision now? What do you how do you see the vision on X. I goal X is to be the best source of truth on the Internet. And I think we're breaking a good, you know, good progress there. I mean, this is going to be like I call everything app like any if anything you want to do you can do on the X platform. Whether it's text, audio, video, payments, financial stuff. Communications of all kinds. And then, but then also where there's publicly disseminated information is to be the best source of truth.

所以只是给定一个金额和一定的时间，无论你在地球上做什么，无论你多么小心。无论是生命还是地球上的生活都将会死亡。这是一个确定性的事件。让我们放大观察。关于X推特。是的。你现在的愿景是什么？你如何看待X的愿景？我的目标是让X成为互联网上最好的真相来源。我认为我们取得了良好的进展。我的意思是，这将会像是一个什么都有的应用，任何你想做的事情都可以在X平台上做到。无论是文本、音频、视频、支付、财务方面的事务、各种形式的沟通。而且，而且公开传播的信息将成为最好的真相来源。

And I think I think it already is that. People may say, oh, there's some piece of misinformation information. I said, yes, but look at the replies. Correct that misinformation and look at community notes and how good the batting average of community notes is it's extremely good. It's by far the best fact checking system on the Internet. So, and a lot of people still labor on the illusion that the legacy newspapers that they read are actually true. There's so much nonsense in them. How many times do you read an article in newspaper where you know the circumstances of what that article is and how often is it spot on. No, of course it's normally, no, of course, we all know it's normally wrong.

而我认为事实已经是这样了。人们可能会说，哦，这有一些错误的信息。我说，是的，但看看回复。纠正那些错误信息，再看看社区笔记，社区笔记的准确率有多高，非常高。它绝对是互联网上最好的事实核查系统。而且很多人仍然固守着他们读的传统报纸实际上是真实的这种幻觉。这些报纸上有太多胡说八道了。你有多少次读到一篇文章你知道那篇文章的情况，它有多准确。不，当然经常不准确，我们都知道通常不准确。

But how do you get the situation now, for instance, with with Russia, you know, the work Russia does in Germany with fake accounts on is pretty, pretty huge activity, right? I mean, we don't see a lot of Russian activity, right? On the system. So, we see very little. We do see a lot of a lot of times to influence things, but they seem to be coming from from the West, not from Russia. Right. What about what about things like the latest developments in in Brazil. And so on. Yeah, so, but the. We're, we kept getting these demands from. This judge Alexander. That's his, that's his name on Twitter at Alexander. And there would be to suspend accounts. Immediately we're given typically two hours to suspend an account or face massive fines. And the final, the final story is we were being given demands to suspend setting setting members of the parliament and major journalists. And so, we could not tell them that this was at the behest of. As under the law, we had to pretend that it was due to our rules of service. And that was the final story.

但是你现在对目前的情况是如何看待的呢？比如说，与俄罗斯有关，在德国，俄罗斯利用假账户进行的活动是非常巨大的，对吧？我的意思是，我们在系统上并没有看到很多俄罗斯的活动，对吧？我们看到的很少，我们看到很多次影响事务的活动，但它们似乎来自西方，而不是俄罗斯。对，那在巴西最新的发展情况呢？等等，但是我们一直收到这些法官亚历山大的要求，他在推特上的名字是亚历山大。我们通常被要求在两小时内暂停账户，否则将面临巨额罚款。最终，我们还被要求暂停议会成员和主要新闻记者的账户，所以我们无法告诉他们这是应某人的要求行事。根据法律，我们必须假装这是由于我们的服务规则。这就是最终的情况。

We said, no. Now, when you, when you bought Twitter, now renamed X, did you expect that you would end up in this type of situation? So is, is all unexpected. Well, I knew it wouldn't be. Just a total better roses. You know, and it's talking. I wouldn't. No, I mean, I thought it would be. It says, like, we're just like, rigorously trying to pursue the. The, the, the goal of being the most accurate and truthful place in the internet. And that, that doesn't mean that what is said is always true or accurate, but it is, it is. Perhaps another way to frame it is as the least inaccurate place on the internet. Do you, do you secretly think this is a bit fun? It's fun. Yeah, yeah, it's fun at times. It's stressful at times and it's fun at times. But in overall, we're trying to serve the people of earth. And, and this is sort of an essence, sort of maybe an esoteric way of doing it, but. To try to be kind of like the group consciousness of earth. So you can think of like, if each person is like a neuron contributing to like the collective brain of earth. And you want to try to minimize the noise and maximize the signal of every neuron that's connected to the, the X network. That's basically what is what is the collective will of humanity and the and how to, and how to. Yeah, just serve the collective will of humanity and serve the greater good that that's our goal. Now, you know, there's definitely going to be people who want to manipulate that information and so retro fight that and try to have.

我们说了不。现在，当你购买了Twitter并将其更名为X后，你曾预料过会陷入这种情况吗？所以，一切都是意外的。嗯，我知道不会。并不都是康庄大道。你知道的，我们说话。我不会。不，我的意思是，我以为会是这样。就是说，我们只是在努力追求成为互联网上最准确和真实的地方。这并不意味着所说的一切都总是真实或准确的，但是它确实是。也许另一种方式来描述就是作为互联网上最少不准确的地方。你是不是暗自觉得这有点有趣？有趣。是的，有时候很有趣。有时候很有压力，有时候很有趣。但总的来说，我们试图为地球上的人们提供服务。这种方式可能有点本质上的，也许是一种神秘的方式，但是。试图成为地球的集体意识。你可以想象，如果每个人都像是一个神经元，为地球的集体大脑做贡献。你想尽量减少噪音，最大限度地增加每个连接到X网络的神经元的信号。基本上，这就是人类的集体意愿是什么，以及如何。是的，只是为了服务人类的集体意愿，为了服务更大的善。这是我们的目标。现在，肯定会有人想操纵这些信息，然后反对并试图。

You know, be the most accurate place as part of the best of our ability and have it be kind of a marketplace of ideas where people can propose ideas and. You know, debate them and. I think so far it's working reasonably well in that regard. People that don't like the truth will not like this X or they want to manipulate things they will not like it. But only a few years ago you were you were a guy. For using electric vehicles. Now you are, you know, through Starlink you've had some, you know, I mean, some big impact in Ukraine with Twitter you are kind of. You know, I'm going to be choosing, you know, Brazil India Turkey. You know, you're becoming like a real geopolitical force. And a really important one how do you, how do you look at that. Well, like I said, I'm really trying to. Take this out of actions that maximize the poverty of the future is good. We have to keep civilization going onward and upward as much as possible. And try to minimize the civilizational threats that occur. Like, you know, we can't get to Mars if civilization collapses. It's not going to happen. So, you know, we've got it. We've got to keep. Keep civilization going. And I think we should view our civilization as being much more fragile. Than we think we can kind of take for granted. Oh, it's always going to be there. But actually if you study history realize that there are rise. You know, there's a rise in sports civilizations. I mean, I was reading in depth about the ancient Sumerians. Who were arguably the first civilization if you call civilization like writing and stuff.

你知道，尽我们最大努力做到最准确的地方，让它成为一个想法的市场，人们可以提出想法并进行辩论。我认为到目前为止，在这方面它运作得相当好。那些不喜欢真相的人不会喜欢这个X，或者他们想操纵事物的人也不会喜欢。但仅仅几年前你还是个使用电动汽车的人。现在，你通过Starlink在乌克兰产生了一些很大的影响，在Twitter上你有一些影响。你在选择巴西、印度和土耳其。你正在成为一个真正的地缘政治力量。是一个非常重要的力量，你如何看待这一点呢。嗯，正如我所说的，我真的在努力使我们的行为最大程度地促进未来的繁荣。我们必须让文明继续前行，尽可能使之向上发展。并尽量减少文明威胁的发生。比如说，你知道，如果文明崩溃，我们就无法去火星。这是不可能的。所以，我们必须让文明继续前行。我认为我们应该把我们的文明看作是比我们想象中更脆弱。我们无法认为它会一直存在。但实际上，如果你研究历史，就会意识到文明的兴衰。我正在深入研究古苏美尔人。他们很可能是第一个文明，如果你把写作之类的东西视为文明的话。

You know, they're the first to develop writing. And, but eventually they died out. And they were gone. So, and then nobody could read the writing at all and they just faded out as a civilization. But they're pretty impressive in their time. And the ancient Egyptians, the same thing. And in one sort of one after another, ancient Greek had a resetters day. You know, China and India had will have incredibly impressive populations, but there's been ebbs and flows in the. China and Indian civilizations over the set the Aons. The or the Blenia as well. So, you know, I guess I'm just trying to take this set of the steps that. I think I'm trying to have the political will go where the people wanted to go. You mentioned some. Some really smart people here and. Kind of just moving tack a bit here to corporate culture. Now you manage a lot of. Geniuses in your. In your companies, what is the key to manage really smart people? You think. I don't. I don't think I managed smart people. I don't think I managed smart people. I don't think I managed smart people. I don't think I managed smart people. They managed themselves. I think.

你知道吗，他们是第一个发展文字的民族。但最终他们灭亡了。他们不复存在了。所以，后来没有人能读懂他们的文字，他们只是逐渐消失作为一个文明。但在他们的时代，他们相当令人印象深刻。古埃及人也是如此。一个古希腊人民拥有重置的一天。你知道，中国和印度有极其令人印象深刻的人口，但中国和印度文明在整个年代中有起起伏伏。也是如此。所以，我想我只是试图追随这一步。我想我正试图使政治去征服人们想要去的地方。你提到一些很聪明的人。有些是。在这里稍微改变话题，谈谈企业文化。你管理着很多天才在你的公司，管理真正聪明的人的关键是什么？你认为。我不认为我管理聪明的人。他们自己管理。我认为。

Well, I guess it was really small people. I don't really think of it like managing them. I think that. If somebody is very smart in town to take they can go anywhere and do anything anytime. Like if they don't have to work with me, they could go anywhere. So I really just say like, look, this is the goal we're after. And this is what we're trying to achieve. And do you agree with this goal? And if you do, then let's try to get it done. And. You know, provide my opinion along the way. And once in a while, I say, look, guys, you just got to trust me on. On this one. We got to do this thing. And if it turns out to be a bad decision. You can all hold that against me in the future. But you have an incredible life of detail, right? I mean, when we read the I6 book, it's pretty clear that you really. A deep into detail and know what you talk about.

嗯，我想可能真的是小人物。我并不认为自己在管理他们。我认为，如果有人在镇上很聪明，他们可以随时去任何地方做任何事情。就好像他们不必和我一起工作，他们可以去任何地方。所以我就只会说，看，这是我们追求的目标。这是我们想要实现的。你同意这个目标吗？如果你同意，那我们就试着把它完成。并且我会在这个过程中提供我的意见。偶尔我会说，看，伙计们，你们要相信我。在这个问题上，我们必须这么做。如果结果证明是个错误决定，你们将来可以责备我。但你们对细节抓得很好，对吧？我是说，当我们读I6这本书时，很清楚你真的非常注重细节，而且知道你在说什么。

So how do you how do you balance this kind of micro management of some areas and then delegate. I wouldn't call it micro management. I'm. I wouldn't call it micro management. It's just insisting on attention to detail. That if you're trying to make a perfect product, you must. Have attention to attention, attention to details that essential. And I haven't actually read the I6 book. You should is very good, actually. I love it. Well, I asked all three things and if I should read it, and he said I shouldn't. So then I said, okay, so then I should read it. Okay. Well, I'll ask you some questions from the book. Then they do talk. He talks about, you know, you kind of the hardcore and ultra hardcore culture. What is an ultra hardcore culture? I guess it's work. I mean, it's working culture, right? I mean, how, I mean, ultra hard work.

那么你怎么在一些领域进行微观管理并委派任务之间取得平衡呢？我不会称之为微观管理。我只是坚持注重细节。如果你想要制造完美的产品，就必须注重细节，这是必不可少的。我实际上还没有读I6这本书。你应该读一下，实际上非常好。我问了他关于这三种事情，是否应该读这本书，他说不应该。所以我说，好的，那我应该读。好的，我会问你一些关于这本书的问题。那个书上谈到了硬核和超硬核文化。什么是超硬核文化？我猜是工作文化，对吧？也就是说，超级努力工作。

How hard is that? Well, when things get really intense, you're basically just working every waking hour. And how long can you do that for? I've done that for. Continuously for sometimes like a few years. What does it do to you? It really, it's pain. And everywhere here, maybe it's an exaggeration. Because there are a few hours. Obviously with friends and family and critical other things. But a hundred hour weeks would be, I've done many, many stretches of hundred hour weeks, like true hundred hour weeks. We're roughly six hours per day of sleeping. I would not recommend that. This is not that that's for emergencies. You know, it's not all the time. You know, during very difficult times at Tesla. I've had to do that.

那有多难呢？嗯，当事情变得非常紧张时，你基本上每个清醒的小时都在工作。你能持续多久呢？我曾经持续这样做。有时像是几年。这对你有什么影响？真的，这是痛苦的。这里可能有些夸张。因为还有几个小时。当然还有朋友、家人和其他重要的事情。但每周一百个小时的工作量，我做过很多次，好几个连续的周，像是真正的一百小时的工作周。大约每天只有六个小时的睡眠时间。我不推荐那样做。那只是为了紧急情况。你知道的，不是一直都这样。在特斯拉非常困难的时期，我不得不这样做。

And I sometimes at the beginning of my earlier startups, I did that. Where I just wouldn't leave the office. I would just leave one on my desk and just work seven days a week. Sometimes it's necessary for success or to avoid failure. But do you enjoy being in this crisis mode? No, I don't. It sucks. Okay. I don't want to be there. There's pain. But sometimes it's the difference between success and failure. When you make decisions, how important is speed? He just gave me an idea, which is. I'm going to invite the judge, Alexander. To do a spaces. And then he can explain why what I'm doing is bad and maybe he's right. I challenge. I challenge him to a spaces. Sounds good. Yeah.

在我早期创业的时候，我有时会这样做。我不会离开办公室，只是把电话放在桌子上，一周七天都在工作。有时为了成功或避免失败，这是必要的。但你喜欢处于这种危机模式吗？不，我不喜欢。这很糟糕。我不想处在那种情况下。那会很痛苦。但有时这决定了成功和失败之间的差别。在你做决定时，速度有多重要？他刚给了我一个主意，那就是。我要邀请评委亚历山大。来进行一场讨论。然后他可以解释为什么我所做的是错误的，也许他是对的。我挑战他来一场讨论。听起来不错。是的。

But what about when you make decisions, how important is speed and how do you balance analysis with your good feeling? I think the best offense and defense is speed. If you think of something like the S.R. 71 blackbird, it really had almost no defenses except accelerate. And it was never shot down even once. I think over 3000 missiles were shot at the S.R. 71 blackbird and none hit. And really what it was just go faster. So the power of speed is. Underappreciated as a competitive dimension. Is that why. You know, space expenses has been so successful. Because you've been mean and lean as an organization. And fast. I think speed is definitely a factor.

但是当你做决定时，速度有多重要，你如何平衡分析与直觉？我认为速度是最好的进攻和防御。如果你想到像S.R. 71黑鸟这样的东西，它实际上几乎没有任何防御，除了加速。它从未被击落过。我认为超过3000枚导弹被发射向S.R. 71黑鸟，但没有一枚击中。其实就是要更快。所以速度的力量是被低估的竞争因素。这是为什么，你知道，太空探索公司取得如此成功吗？因为你们作为一个组织，既凶狠又迅速。我认为速度绝对是一个因素。

Now I should say you want to go in the case for company. You need to go back to not a scalar. So it can't be you need to go at high speed in the right direction. Sure. So I can't just. And no company is going to be going in the right direction all the time. So you have to do course corrections. Like a guided missile recorded course corrections. And in the case of space X, it's like, okay, our goal is to extend humanity beyond us. And we didn't even know how to even frame the question correctly. Like what. We didn't know that that was a general goal. We didn't know what talent would use or what the raw materials would be or for the, how would the rocket be built? How would it be designed? What's actually. Important. And, you know, so for example, going from our. Falcon architecture, which is. Uses for fine jet fuel and production. It has. Open cycle gas generator architecture engine to a to Starship, which is. A liquid methane liquid auction.

现在我需要说的是，你想要在公司中前进。你需要回到不是一个标量。所以不能只是你需要以高速朝正确方向前进。当然。所以我不能只是这样。而且没有任何公司会一直朝正确方向前进。所以你需要进行修正。就像制导导弹记录的修正。对于SpaceX来说，就像，好的，我们的目标是推动人类超越我们自己。我们甚至不知道怎么才能正确地提出这个问题。就像是什么。我们不知道那是一个普遍的目标。我们不知道会用到什么才能或者原材料将会是什么，或对于火箭，它是怎么建造的？它会如何设计？什么是真正重要的。你知道，比如从我们的猎鹰架构，使用精细喷气燃料和生产。它具有。开环气体发生器架构引擎，转变到Starship，这是。一个液态甲烷和液态氧。

Propulent in a staged combustion. Very high pressure engine. That's a big architectural change. But we didn't know that we needed to make that architectural change until we're pretty far down the road. Like about halfway, but because about 10 years to figure out that was even the right architecture. Now we're confident it is just we were on risk taking in so on. I think space X is one of the best example I know about all what we call failing well right learning from mistakes and moving on. Generally, how do you hold you look at mistakes. Well, I mean, which which ones do you tolerate and which ones don't you tolerate? Well, I think. I don't really think of that way. You know, the first three flights of space X failed. The fourth one succeeded.

在一个分级燃烧的推进下。非常高压的引擎。这是一个巨大的建筑变化。但是我们并不知道我们需要做这种建筑变化，直到我们走得很远。大约一半的路程，但是因为需要大约10年的时间来确定这是否是正确的架构。现在我们很自信，只是我们愿意承担风险之类的。我认为SpaceX是一个很好的例子，我知道所有我们所说的一个很好的例子，从失败中学习并继续前进。总的来说，你如何看待错误。嗯，我想说。你容忍哪些错误，不容忍哪些错误？嗯，我认为不是那样想。你知道，SpaceX的头三次飞行失败了。第四次成功了。

And if the fourth one had not succeeded, we would have gone bankrupt. We would have had no money left. So, I think it was very close call. But since then space X has done very well. It's now the park nine knock on wood is the most reliable rocket in the world. And launches about every two to three days. Now, last question on risk. What are the types of risk you would not want to take? Well, I think in terms of risks, you don't you don't want to take risks that way. If you only want to take that the company risks if they're absolutely necessary. So there have been a few times where saying that with Tesla, we just had no choice but to vent the company. Because if we're if we're doing a new vehicle program that is. In order of magnitude.

如果第四次尝试没有成功，我们就会破产。我们将没有剩余的钱。因此，我认为那时危险很接近。但自那时以来，SpaceX表现得非常出色。现在，它是世界上最可靠的火箭，平均每两到三天发射一次。现在，关于风险的最后一个问题。有哪些类型的风险是您不愿意冒的？嗯，我认为在冒险方面，您不应该冒那种风险。只有在绝对必要的情况下才愿意承担公司风险。所以有几次我们必须冒风险，比如说在特斯拉，我们别无选择，只能冒公司风险。因为如果我们在进行一项新车型项目，那就是一个数量级的风险。

The last one, then we're just unequivocally betting the company because the new vehicle will be 90% of production. So going from the original Roadster to the Model S original road to was only, you know, about 600. 6, 700 per year. Then Model S was 20,000 per year. And then Model three is sort of half, you know, sort of half a million per year. Model Y over a million per year. So these are all bet the company vehicles. But the reason we could do, for example, the cyber truck, which was kind of a. A radical new design was because it wasn't a bet the company decision. So it's like, okay, look, let's try something. I want to try something totally crazy. It's like what truck would blade runner drive.

最后一个，然后我们就毅然决定赌上整个公司，因为新车型将占据90%的生产量。从最初的Roadster到Model S最初版本，产量只有，你知道，大约600辆。然后Model S增加到每年20,000辆。然后Model 3是大致上一半，你知道，大约每年50万辆。Model Y每年超过一百万辆。这些都是赌上整个公司的车型。但我们之所以能做出像Cybertruck这样的，有些激进的全新设计，是因为这并不是赌上公司的决定。所以就像是，好，让我们试试看。我想尝试一些完全疯狂的东西。就像，银翼杀手会开什么样的卡车。

Something when you're going to drive a loss. Yeah, I think it would be perfect for miles. But like we could try something that where there's some chance that people might not like it. But it's it's radical and new and it's. A static aesthetically, it's not derivative. It doesn't look like anything else on the road. Whereas all the other sort of pickup trucks look like made copies of one another. They were good support to take a chance on failure and say like and talk it up to, you know, well, we tried, you know, we tried to do something interesting. But actually, by the way, cyber trucks doing great. So.

当你要冒险尝试一种损失的东西。是的，我觉得对于长距离行驶来说会很完美。但我们可以尝试一些可能不被人们喜欢的东西。但这是激进的和新颖的。在审美上是静态的，不是派生的。它看起来不像路上的任何其他车辆。而所有其他的皮卡看起来就像是复制品。他们在支持冒险尝试失败，并表示尽管是失败，但我们试过了，你知道，我们试图做一些有趣的事情。但实际上，顺便说一句，赛博卡车现在做得很好。所以。

But one of the things that I think is important for innovation is that you do accept failure. Like like necessarily you have to always look at the incentive structure of an organization and say. You know, is it is it is it organization properly in sending innovation and in within it. If you do innovation, you're necessarily going to uncharted territory. So they're going to be some mistakes. They're going to be some failures. And you have to like actually like for SpaceX rocket engine development. Like I keep telling the team look, if we're not occasionally blowing up an engine on the test and we're not trying hard enough. You know, absolutely.

但我认为创新中重要的一点是要接受失败。你必须始终看待组织的激励结构，并问自己，这个组织是否适当地激励创新。如果你在创新，你必定要涉足未知领域。所以会有一些错误，会有一些失败。你必须像SpaceX火箭发动机开发一样，我一直告诉团队，如果我们不偶尔在测试中引爆发动机，那就表示我们努力不够。是的，绝对是这样。

How important are the pea, how important is research and PhDs and that kind of stuff. I think I've said seen some where you think most PhDs are useless. Well, I think most PhD theses are useless, which I think is actually objectively true. If you look at how many PhD. Look at all how many PhDs are created every year and how many of those papers are actually used in anything. Yeah, then objectively most PhDs are have very low utility or maybe zero because nobody uses them. Or so once in a while you get something that is spectacular, but it's pretty rare. Perhaps something more useful is like some in the book that you haven't read talks about your love for gaming in particular, like strategic ability gaming. And I've been thinking quite a lot about it. What have you learned from from those games and have have that learning and wisdom been helpful when you have been planning your companies.

豌豆有多重要，研究和博士学位有多重要，这类的东西。我觉得有些人认为大多数博士学位是无用的。我认为大多数博士论文是没有用的，我认为这其实是客观真相。看看每年有多少博士学位被授予，有多少论文实际上被应用在实际中。是的，客观来说，大多数博士学位的效用非常低，甚至可以说是零，因为没有人会使用它们。偶尔会有一些惊人的成果，但这相当罕见。也许更有用的是一本书中提到的你对游戏特别是战略游戏的热爱。我一直在思考此事。你从这些游戏中学到了什么，这些知识和智慧在你规划公司时有帮助吗？

Yeah, I. It's hard to say exactly what I've learned from the games that I do like playing video games as if I want to take my mind off work. I'll typically play a very hard video game. Such as which one. Well, over the years, it's been many, many different video games. So, you know, when I was a little kid, I was like, you know, pong and the little tank games and things and. And if you take a game like, for example, civilization, it's actually quite a good. It tells you how civilizations are formed. Like I remember, I remember playing the original civilization with the technology tree and how you'd vent different things. You'd like invent literacy and. You know, invent democracy and. And then to gun gun power, there will be all these things that like, and you start to realize, oh, wow, there's. There are stages to technology, like you can't. You know, you can't actually get to democracy without literacy. And. You know, so there's these stages of technology development or stages of ideas. That's a. You know, that's a helpful framework for a company.

是的，对我来说很难准确地说我从游戏中学到了什么，我喜欢玩视频游戏，就好像我想要让自己从工作中抽离一样。我通常会玩一些非常困难的视频游戏。举个例子来说吧。嗯，多年来，有很多不同的视频游戏。所以，你知道，当我还是个小孩的时候，我喜欢打乒乓球、玩一些坦克游戏之类的。比如说，以文明这款游戏为例，它其实很棒。它告诉你文明是如何形成的。比如说，我记得我玩过原始文明，里面有科技树和你会发明不同的事物。你会发明文字和民主。然后到火药时代，会出现很多类似的东西，然后你就开始意识到，哦，原来科技有阶段性，你没法不先学会文字就得民主。你知道，所以科技发展有循序渐进的阶段，或者说创意有阶段性。这是一个对公司有帮助的框架。

And I guess in like, like I say, in recent years, there's a game I played that was. Actually developed in Sweden called Polytopia, which is actually quite a good game. Like a lot of people like playing chess, but I think chess is not a great. There's not a lot of transfer learning from chess to the real world because in chess, you've got. Only 64 squares. It's a set piece battle, same pieces every time there are no terrain differences. There's no technology tree. There's no fog of war. But say a game like Polytopia has all of those things, random terrain generation. You know, the differences in attacking defense bonuses depending on what type of terrain. You've got 16 tribes, I think, each with different abilities. You've got a technology tree that you can choose to develop in different ways. And you've got, of course, fog of war. So that I think is much more much closer to reality. Yeah. So I think for Polytopia, I mean, I was playing Diablo for a while. Pretty fun. Diablo at high levels gets very complicated. You could call it like a spreadsheet where the game attached. So that's, that's, and I briefly got the provided day, the world record in this avatar of zero on a four person team. Of clearing the hardest level, which was, you know, not bad for someone who's like 53. Basically, we'll be 53 soon. There is some Twitch element to it. And it's hard to beat kids at games with a Twitch element. But yeah, I like, I find these games interesting if you can be fully immersed in a game. Some last questions here. As you know, we are big shoulders and made a model, a lot of money on our investment. Okay. Okay. Okay. Good. Good to go. Sorry. I can, I think everyone can hear me. Let's see. Thumbs up if you can hear me. Let's try again. Okay. Okay. Sounds good. Now, what is this going on in terms of the union in Sweden and the collective bargaining. Actually, I think, I think the storm has passed on that front. I think things are. I think it's a reasonably good shape in Sweden. So. Yeah, so thanks being so good. Yeah. Overall, yeah, I feel pretty good about the future. I mean, you know, there's going to be bumpy quarters from here and there, but I think the long term future of Tesla is extremely strong. For example. Yeah. I'm back on just so. Yeah, we met with a, we met with your chair last month. So we, we have some update, but any, any of you on it. Why are you, why are you skeptical to.

我想说，在最近几年里，我玩过一个来自瑞典开发的游戏，叫做Polytopia，实际上是一个相当不错的游戏。很多人喜欢下象棋，但我认为象棋并不是一个很好的游戏。象棋无法将学到的知识转移到现实世界中，因为在象棋中只有64个方格，这是一场固定的战斗，每次都是相同的棋子，没有地形差异，没有科技树，没有迷雾战争。但是Polytopia这样的游戏包含了所有这些元素，包括随机地形生成，攻击和防御奖励的差异取决于地形类型，有16个不同的部落，每个都有不同的能力，有一个科技树可以选择不同的发展方式，当然还有迷雾战争。我觉得这更接近现实。我认为Polytopia是一个很有趣的游戏。在高难度下，Diablo变得非常复杂，你可以将其称为一个游戏附着的电子表格。我曾一度在四人团队中以Zero的形象打破了最难级别的世界纪录，这对一个即将53岁的人来说还不错。游戏中有一些直播元素，要在有直播元素的游戏中击败孩子们是很困难的，但我发现这些游戏很有趣，如果你能完全沉浸其中。最后有一些问题。你们知道，我们是一家大投资者，为我们的投资赚了很多钱。好的，好的，抱歉，我觉得每个人都能听到我。让我们再试一次。如果你能听到我的话，请竖起大拇指。好的，好的。听起来不错。现在，在瑞典工会和集体谈判方面发生了什么情况。实际上，我认为这方面的风暴已经过去了。瑞典的情况相当不错。所以，一切顺利。是的，感谢大家一直以来的好处。总的来说，我对未来感到非常乐观。我知道未来会有一些波折，但我认为特斯拉的长期未来非常强劲。例如。是的，我又回来了。是的，我们上个月与你们的主席开了会。我们有一些消息更新，但你们有没有其他问题？为什么对此持怀疑态度呢？

I was playing with the sound board here. Hello. Hello. Hello. Hello, hello. Yeah, last question for me. Sorry, I didn't have the answer because I was out, but we have covered this with, with your chair. But just a last question. What do you want your legacy to be. I don't, I don't mind if my legacy is accurate or inaccurate. I provided that I, I dive. Feeling that I've done the right thing for the future of consciousness. So just trying to, trying to have this, this life consciousness last as long as possible, and maybe understand more about the nature of the universe or simulation or whatever this is. So. I have a philosophy of curiosity, which is to understand the. They understand the universe understand the nature of the universe. Or even what questions to ask. Kind of like the, I would say, I would subscribe to the Douglas Adams, Hijagas guy to the galaxy school of philosophy. That we're trying to understand what questions to ask about the answer that is the universe. Okay, I think that's a good place to end. For sure the life on this planet will have been a lot more boring without you. I'm glad to spice it up a little. Totally. All right, good talking. Bye. Take it off. All right. Bye. Thanks. Bye.

我在这里和音响设备玩耍。你好。你好。你好。你好，你好。是的，最后一个问题。抱歉，我没有答案，因为我不在，但我们已经讨论过这个问题，和你的椅子。但最后一个问题是，你想要留下什么样的遗产。我不在乎我的遗产是准确还是错误的。只要我觉得我已经为意识的未来做了正确的事情。所以我想尽可能让这种生命意识延续下去，也许更多地了解宇宙或模拟的本质，或者无论这到底是什么。所以。我有一种探索的哲学，就是去了解宇宙的本质。甚至知道要问哪些问题。有点像我会订阅道格拉斯·亚当斯《银河系漫游指南》学派的。我们努力了解应该问什么问题，才能理解宇宙的答案。好的，我觉得这是个好地方结束。毫无疑问，在这个星球上的生活如果没有你，将会变得更加乏味。我很高兴能稍稍增添一点情趣。完全赞同。好的，聊得愉快。再见。结束。好的。再见。谢谢。再见。