TikTok CEO Shou Chew on Its Future — and What Makes Its Algorithm Different | Live at TED2023

It's very nice to have you here. Let's see, first of all, congratulations. You really put off something remarkable on that grilling. You achieved something that very few people do, which was you pulled off a bipartisan consensus in US politics. It was great. You know. The bad news was that that consensus largely seemed to be we must ban TikTok. So we're going to come to that in a bit. And I'm curious. But before we go there, we need to know about you. You seem to me like a remarkable person. I want to know a bit of your story and how you came to TikTok in the first place.

很高兴你能来到这里。首先，祝贺你。你在听证会上表现得非常出色，达成了一件很少有人能做到的事情，那就是在美国政治中取得了两党共识。这真是太棒了。不过，坏消息是，这个共识主要是我们必须禁止TikTok。我们稍后会谈到这个话题，我很好奇。但在此之前，我们需要了解你。你在我看来是一个非常了不起的人，我想了解一下你的故事以及你是如何来到TikTok的。

OK, thank you, Chris. Before we do that, can I just check, I need to know my audience. How many of you here use TikTok? Just, oh, thank you. For those who don't, the Wi-Fi is free. So. So. So that's another question, which is, how many of you here have had your lives touched through TikTok, through your kids and other people in your lives? I mean, it's great to see it. It's basically, if you're alive, you have had some kind of contact with TikTok at this point. Thank you. Tell us about you.

好的，谢谢你，克里斯。在我们开始之前，我有一个问题，我需要了解一下我的观众。这里有多少人使用抖音？哦，谢谢你们。对于那些没有使用的人，Wi-Fi 是免费的。所以。所以。所以还有一个问题是，这里有多少人因为孩子或生活中的其他人而间接接触过抖音？我的意思是，看到这一点真是太好了。如果你活在当下，你很可能已经以某种方式接触过抖音。谢谢。请介绍一下你自己。

So my name is Shao, and I'm from Singapore. Roughly 10 years ago, I met with two engineers who were building a product. And the idea behind this was to build a product that recommended content to people, not based on who they knew, which was, if you think about it, 10 years ago, it was all the social graph was all the rage. And the idea was, your content and the feed that you saw should be based on people that you knew. About 10 years ago, these two engineers thought about something different, which is, instead of showing you what you. Instead of showing you people you knew, why do we show you content that you liked? And that's sort of the genesis and the birth of the early iterations of TikTok. And about five years ago, with the advent of 4G short video, mobile phone penetration, TikTok was born. And a couple of years ago, I had the opportunity to run this company, and it still excites me every single day.

我的名字是邵，我来自新加坡。大约十年前，我遇到了两位工程师，他们正在开发一个产品。这个产品的想法是向人们推荐内容，但不是基于他们认识的人（毕竟10年前，社交图谱非常流行，内容和信息流都是基于你认识的人）。这两位工程师有一个不同的想法——为什么不根据你喜欢的内容来推荐呢？这就是抖音早期版本的起源和诞生。大约五年前，随着4G短视频和手机普及，抖音正式诞生。几年前，我有机会负责这家公司，每一天我依然充满激情。

So I want to dig in a little more into this. About what was it that made this TikTok so explicit? Because the language I hear from people who, you know, spent time on it, it's sort of like. I mean, it is a different level of addiction to other media out there. And I don't necessarily mean this in a good way. We'll be coming on to it. There's good and bad things about this type of addiction. But it's the feeling that within a couple days of experience of TikTok, it knows you. And it surprises you with things that you didn't know you were going to be interested in. But you are. How? Is it really just, instead of the social graph, what are these algorithms doing? I think to describe this, to begin to answer your question, we have to talk about the mission of the company. Now, the mission is to inspire creativity and to bring joy. And I think it, our missions for companies like ours, is really important because you have product managers working on the product every single day, and they need to have a North Star. You know, something to sort of work towards together. Now, based on this mission, our vision is to provide three things to our users. We want to provide a window to discover, and I'll talk about discovery. You talked about this in a second. We want to give them a canvas to create, which is going to be really exciting with new technologies in AI that's going to help people, you know, help people create new things. And the final thing is bridges for people to connect. So that's what the vision of what we're trying to build.

好的，我想进一步探讨一下这个问题。究竟是什么让这个TikTok如此特别？因为我从那些花时间在上面的人那里听说的语言，感觉是，这种上瘾的程度与其他媒体完全不同。我不一定是以一种好的方式来说这个。我们稍后会谈到这种上瘾的优缺点。但问题在于，仅仅几天的TikTok体验，就让它似乎知道你。它会惊喜地推送一些你没想到自己会感兴趣的内容。但是你确实会感兴趣。这是怎么做到的？难道不是社交图谱，而是这些算法在起作用吗？ 我认为，要回答这个问题，我们必须先谈谈公司的使命。现在，我们的使命是激发创造力并带来快乐。我认为，对于像我们这样的公司来说，使命真的很重要，因为产品经理每天都在产品上工作，他们需要有个方向，一个共同努力的目标。 基于这个使命，我们的愿景是为用户提供三样东西。我们希望提供一个发现的窗口，我稍后会谈到发现功能。我们希望提供一个创造的画布，随着新的人工智能技术的发展，这将会非常令人兴奋，因为它将帮助人们创造新的事物。最后，我们希望架起人们连接的桥梁。这就是我们试图构建的愿景。

Now, what really makes TikTok very unique and very different is the whole discovery engine behind us. So there are earlier apps that I have a lot of respect for, but they were built for a different purpose. You know, for example, in the era of search, you know, there was an app that was built for people who wanted to search things that was so that it's more easily found. And then in the era of social graphs, it was about connecting people and their followers. Now, what we have done is that we are based on our machine learning algorithms. We're showing people what they liked. And what this means is that we have given the everyday person a platform to be discovered. If you have talent, it is very, very easy to get discovered on TikTok. And I'll just give you one example of this.

现在，让TikTok真正独特和与众不同的是我们背后的整个发现引擎。以前的一些应用程序，我非常尊敬它们，但是它们是为不同的目的而设计的。例如，在搜索时代，有一款应用是为了让人们更容易找到所需信息而设计的；而在社交图谱时代，则是为了连接人与他们的关注者。现在，我们所做的是基于我们的机器学习算法，向用户展示他们喜欢的内容。这意味着我们给了普通人一个被发现的平台。如果你有才华，在TikTok上被发现是非常容易的。我给你举一个例子。

The biggest creator on TikTok is a guy called Kavi. Kavi was from Senegal. He listened to Italy. He was a factory worker. He, you know, for the longest time, didn't even speak in any of his videos. But what he did was he had talent. He was funny. He had a good expression. He had creativity, so he kept posting. And today, he has 160 million followers on our platform. So every single day, we hear stories like that. You know, businesses, people with talent. And I think it's very freeing to have a platform where, as long as you have talent, you're going to be hurt and you have the chance to succeed. And that's what we're providing to our users.

TikTok上最大的创作者是一个叫Kavi的小伙子。Kavi来自塞内加尔，但他住在意大利。他是一名工厂工人。很长一段时间里，他甚至在视频中都不说话。但他有才华，他很幽默，他表情丰富，也很有创意，所以他不断发布视频。今天，他在我们的平台上有1.6亿粉丝。每天我们都会听到类似的故事。不管是企业还是有才华的人，我觉得有一个平台，只要你有才华，你就会被听见，你就有机会成功。这就是我们提供给用户的。

So this is the amazing thing to me. Like most of us have grown up with, say, network television. Where for decades, you've had thousands of brilliant, creative people toiling in the trenches, trying to imagine stuff that will be amazing for an audience. And none of them ever remotely came up with anything that looked like many of your creators. So these algorithms, just by observing people's behavior and what they look like, have discovered things that thousands of brilliant humans never discovered. Tell me some of the things that it is looking at. So obvious things like if someone presses like or stays on a video for a long time, that gives you a clue more like that. But is it subject matter? What are the array of things that you have noticed that you can actually track, that provide useful clues?

这件事让我感到非常惊奇。像我们大多数人一样，我们是随着网络电视的成长一起长大的。在几十年的时间里，成千上万的聪明且有创造力的人们埋头苦干，试图想象出能让观众感到惊奇的东西。但他们中的任何一人都从未能想出任何像你们创造者那样的东西。所以，这些算法仅仅通过观察人们的行为和外貌，就发现了成千上万聪明人从未发现的东西。告诉我一些它在观察的东西吧。显而易见的事情，比如某人按了“赞”或长时间停留在某个视频上，这给了你更多线索。那它还会看内容话题吗？你注意到了哪些可以实际追踪，并提供有用线索的方面？

I'm going to simplify this a lot. But the machine learning, the recommendation algorithm is really just math. So for example, if you like videos one, two, three, and four, and I like videos one, two, three, and five, maybe he likes videos one, two, three, and six. Now what's going to happen is, because we like one, two, three at the same time, he's going to be shown four, five, six. And so are we. And you can think about this repeated at scale in real time, across more than a billion people. That's basically what it is, is math. And of course, you know, AI and machine learning has allowed this to be done at a very, very big scale. And what we have seen, the result of this, is that it learns the interest signals that people exhibit very quickly and shows you content that's really relevant for you in a very quick way.

我会尽量简化。在这里，推荐算法其实只是数学的应用。打个比方，如果你喜欢视频一、二、三和四，而我喜欢视频一、二、三和五，也许另一个人喜欢视频一、二、三和六。因为我们都同时喜欢视频一、二和三，系统会推荐四、五、六给另一个人，也会推荐给我们。你可以想象，将这种模式实时应用到超过十亿人身上，基本上就是这么回事。当然，人工智能和机器学习使得这种推荐能够在非常大规模上进行。我们看到的结果是，它能非常快速地学习到人们的兴趣信号，并迅速展示出与你非常相关的内容。

Now, so it's a form of collaborative thought trick from what you're saying. The theory behind it is that these humans are weird people. We don't really know what they're interested in. But if we see that one human is interested with an overlap of someone else, chances are, you know, you can make use of the other pieces that are in that overlap, humans repertoire to feed them, and they'll be surprised. But the reason they like it is because their power also liked it. It's pattern recognition based on your interest signals. And I think the other thing here is that we don't actually ask you 20 questions on whether you like a piece of content, you know, what are your interests, we don't do that. We build that experience organically into the app experience. So you are voting with your thumbs, you know, by watching a video, you know, by typing it, by liking it, by sharing it. You are basically exhibiting interest signals. And what it does automatically is to take those signals, put it in a formula, and then matches it through a pattern recognition. That's basically the idea behind it.

现在，根据你所说的，这是一种协作性思维的技巧。其理论基础是认为这些人类都是奇怪的人。我们并不真正知道他们对什么感兴趣。但如果我们发现一个人对某些东西感兴趣，而这个东西也吸引了另一个人，那么很有可能你可以利用这些重叠的兴趣来吸引他们，他们会感到惊喜。他们喜欢这些东西的原因是因为他们的同类也喜欢。这实际上是基于兴趣信号的模式识别。另外一点是，我们并不会问你20个问题来判断你是否喜欢某个内容，我们不会这样做。相反，我们将这种体验有机地融入应用程序体验中。你通过观看视频、输入、点赞和分享等操作投出你的“兴趣票”。它会自动获取这些信号，放入一个公式中，通过模式识别来匹配。这就是其背后的基本理念。

I mean, lots of startups have tried to use these types of techniques. I'm wondering what else played a role early on. I mean, how big a deal was it that from the get-go, you were optimizing for smartphones, so that videos were shot in portrait format and they were short? Was that an early distinguishing thing that mattered? I think we were the first to really try this at scale. You know, the recommendation algorithm is a very important reason as to why the platform is so popular among so many people. But beyond that, you know, you mentioned the format itself. So we talked about the vision of the company, which is to have a window to discover. And if you sort of just open it up for the first time, you'll see that it takes up your whole screen. So that's the window that we want. You can imagine a lot of people using that window to discover new things in their lives.

我的意思是，很多初创公司都试图使用这些类型的技术。我想知道还有什么在早期起了作用。我的意思是，从一开始你就针对智能手机进行了优化，让视频以竖屏格式拍摄并且短小，这有多重要？这是一个在早期很重要的区别吗？我觉得我们是第一个真正大规模尝试这种做法的。你知道，推荐算法是平台在这么多人中受欢迎的一个非常重要的原因。但除此之外，你提到的格式本身也很关键。我们谈到公司的愿景，就是要有一个发现世界的窗口。如果你第一次打开应用，你会发现它占满了整个屏幕。这就是我们想要的窗口。你可以想象，很多人都在利用这个窗口来发现生活中的新事物。

Then, you know, through this recommendation algorithm, we have found that it connects people together. People find communities. And I've heard so many stories of people who have found their communities because of the content they're posting. Now, I'll give you an example. I was in D.C. recently, and I met with a bunch of creators. I heard. Yes. And so one of them was sitting next to me at a dinner. His name is Samuel. He runs a restaurant in Phoenix, Arizona. And he's a taco restaurant. He told me he's never done this before, first, you know, venture. He started posting all this content on TikTok. And, you know, I saw his content. It looks, I was hungry after looking at it. It's just great, you know, content. And he's generated so much interest in his business that last year he made something like a million dollars in revenue.

然后，你知道，通过这个推荐算法，我们发现它能把人们联系在一起。人们找到了各自的社区。我听过很多人因为发布内容而找到了他们的社区的故事。现在，我举个例子。最近我在华盛顿特区，见了一群创作者。是的，我听了他们的故事。其中有一个人在晚餐时坐在我旁边。他叫塞缪尔，在亚利桑那州凤凰城经营一家餐馆，是一家墨西哥卷饼餐馆。他告诉我这是他第一次做这个，他开始在TikTok上发布所有这些内容。我看了他的内容，看完后都饿了，真的很棒的内容。他在自己的生意上引起了极大的兴趣，去年他的收入大约有一百万美元。

Just via TikTok, one restaurant. And again and again, I hear these stories. You know, by connecting people together, by giving people the window to discover, we have given many small businesses and many people, your common person, a voice that they will never otherwise have. And I think that's the power of the platform. So you definitely have identified early, just how, you know, we're social creatures, we need affirmation. I've heard a story, and you can tell me whether true or not, that one of the keys to your early liftoff was that you wanted to persuade creators who were trying out TikTok, that this was a platform where, you know, they would get response early on when you're trying to grow something.

仅通过TikTok，一个餐馆。一次又一次地，我听到这些故事。通过将人们连接在一起，通过给予人们一个发现的窗口，我们给了许多小企业和普通人一个他们从未有过的声音。我认为这是这个平台的力量。所以你们绝对早早地意识到，我们是社会性生物，我们需要认可。我听过一个故事，你可以告诉我是否属实，说你们早期成功的关键之一是你们想说服尝试TikTok的创作者，这个平台会让他们在初期就能得到回应，从而帮助他们成长。

The numbers aren't there for response. So you had the brilliant idea of goofing those numbers a bit, basically finding ways to give people, you know, a bigger sense of, like, more likes, more engagement than was actually the case by using AI agents somehow in the process. Is that a brilliant idea or is that just a myth? I would describe it in a different way. So there are other platforms that exist, you know, before TikTok. And if you think about those platforms, you sort of have to be famous already in order to get followers. Because the way it's built is that people come and follow people. And if you don't, if you aren't already famous, the chances that you get discovered are very, very low.

数字没有呈现出预期的反应。所以你提出了一个聪明的主意，通过利用AI代理来稍微调整这些数字，基本上就是找到一些方法，让人们感觉到有更多的点赞和互动，而实际上并非如此。这是个聪明的主意还是只是一个传闻？我会用不同的方式来描述。在TikTok之前，还有其他平台存在。如果你想一下那些平台，你大概需要已经很有名才能获得粉丝。因为这些平台的机制是人们来关注已经有名的人。如果你本身不出名，被发现的几率非常低。

Now, what we have done, again, because of the difference in the way we're recommending content, is that we have given anyone, any single person, with enough talent, a stage to be able to be discovered. And I think that actually is the single, probably the most important thing, contributing to the growth of the platform. And again and again, you'll hear stories from people who use the platform, who post regularly on it, that if they have something they want to say, the platform gives them the chance and the stage, the connect of the audience, in a way that I think no other product in the past has ever offered them.

现在，我们之所以这样做，是因为我们推荐内容的方式不同。这使得任何有才华的人都有机会被发现。我认为，这可能是促进平台增长的重要原因。很多经常在这个平台上发帖的人会一次又一次地告诉你，如果他们有话要说，这个平台能给他们机会和舞台，与观众连接，这在过去的产品中是前所未有的。

So I'm just trying to play back what you said there. You said you were describing a different way, what I said. Is it then the case that, like, to give someone a decent chance, someone who's brilliant, but doesn't come with any followers initially, that you have, you've got some technique to identify talent and that you will almost encourage them, you will give them some kind of, you know, artificially increase the number of followers or likes or whatever that they have. So that others are encouraged to go, wow, there's something there and so forth.

所以，我只是想回顾一下你刚才说的话。你说你在描述一种不同的方式，对吧？是不是这样：为了给某个有才华但最初没有任何追随者的人一个好的机会，你有某种方法来识别他们的才能，并且你会鼓励他们，甚至人为地增加他们的追随者或点赞数量，让其他人看到后会觉得，很不错，有所行动等等。

Like it's this idea of critical mass that kind of every entrepreneur, every party planner kind of knows about it. Now, this is the hot place in town, everyone come, and that that is how you actually gain critical mass. We want to make sure that every person who posts a video is given an equal chance to be able to have some audience to begin with. But this idea that you are maybe alluding to, that we can get people to like something, it doesn't really work like that. But then you get, could you get AI agents to like something? Could you see the network with extra AI agents that could kind of give someone early encouragement?

就像这个关键群众的概念，几乎每个企业家、每个派对策划者都知道它。现在，这里是城里最热门的地方，大家都来，这就是你实际上获得关键群众的方法。我们想确保每个发布视频的人都有平等的机会在一开始就获得一定的受众。但是你可能提到的这个想法，即我们可以让人们喜欢某样东西，这其实并不是那么运作的。那么，我们能否让人工智能代理喜欢某样东西？我们能否用额外的人工智能代理在网络上给某人早期的鼓励呢？

Ultimately, what the machine does is it recognizes people's interests. So if you post something that's not interesting to a lot of people, even if you gave it a lot of exposure, you're not going to get the virality that you want. Whereas, so it's a lot of, you know, there's no push here. You know, it's not like you can go and push something, because I like Chris, you know, I'm going to push your content, and it doesn't work like that. You've got to have a message that resonates with people, and if it does, then it will automatically just have the virality itself. That's the beauty of user generator content. It's not something that can be engineered or overthought. You know, it really is something that has to resonate with the audience.

最终，机器做的事情是识别人们的兴趣。所以如果你发布的内容对很多人来说并不有趣，即使它被大量曝光，你也无法获得你想要的病毒式传播。换句话说，这里没有强推功能。你不能只是因为喜欢某个人，就去推他们的内容，那是行不通的。你必须有一个能够引起人们共鸣的信息，如果有了，那么它就会自动传播开来。这就是用户生成内容的魅力所在。这不是可以被设计或过度思考的东西，它确实需要与观众产生共鸣。

And if it does, then it goes viral. I'm now speaking privately with an investor who knows your company quite well, who said that actually the level of sophistication of the algorithms you have going is just another order of magnitude to what competitors like Facebook or YouTube have going. Is that just hype, or do you really believe you? Like, how complex are these algorithms? Well, I think in terms of complexity, there are many companies with a lot of resources and a lot of talent. You know, they will figure out even the most complex algorithms.

如果真是这样的话，那就会迅速传播开来。我现在在私下与一位非常了解你们公司的投资者沟通，他说你们公司的算法复杂程度比Facebook或YouTube这样的竞争对手要高出好几个数量级。这只是炒作，还是真的这样？比如说，你们的算法到底有多复杂？好吧，我认为在算法复杂度方面，有很多公司拥有大量资源和人才，他们也能搞定最复杂的算法。

I think what is very different is your mission of your company, how you started the company. Like I said, we started with this idea that this was the main use case. The most important use case is you come and you get to see you recommend their content. Now, for some other apps out there, they are very significant and have a lot of users. They're built for a different original purpose. And if you're built for something different, then your users are used to that because the community comes in and they expect that sort of experience. So I think the pivot away from that is not really just a matter of engineering and algorithms.

我认为非常不同的是你们公司的使命以及你们公司是如何起步的。就像我之前说的，我们一开始是有一个主要用途的想法。最重要的用途是用户能够来到这里，看到我们推荐的内容。然而，对于一些其他的应用来说，它们也很重要并且有很多用户，但它们是为不同的初衷而创建的。因为用途不同，用户习惯于这一点，所以社区成员也期望这种体验。因此，我认为转变方向不仅仅是工程和算法的问题。

It's a matter of what your company is built to begin with, which is why I started this by saying you need to have a vision, you need to have a mission. And that's the north start of what you can't just shift it halfway. Right. And it's fair to say that because your start point has been interest algorithms rather than social graph algorithms, you've been able to avoid some of the worst of the sort of the filter bubbles that have happened in other social media, where you have tribes kind of declaring, worrying each other effectively. And so much of the noise and energy is around that. Do you believe that you've largely avoided that on TikTok?

这取决于你的公司最初是如何建立的，这也是为什么我一开始就说你需要有一个愿景和使命。而这就是你不能在中途随便改变的指引方向。对你们来说，很公平地说，因为你们的起点是兴趣算法而不是社交图谱算法，你们已经能够避免其他社交媒体上发生的最糟糕的“滤泡”现象，在那些平台上，不同的群体彼此对立、争吵不休，消耗了大量的噪音和精力。你认为TikTok在很大程度上避免了这种情况吗？

The diversity of content that our users see is very key, you know, in order for the discovery and the mission is to discover. So sorry, the vision is to discover. So in order to facilitate that, it is very important to us that what the users see is the diversity of content. Now, generally speaking, you know, there are certain issues that you mentioned that the industry faces, you know, there are some bad actors who come on the internet. They pose bad content. Now, our approach is that we have very clear community guidelines.

用户看到的内容多样性非常关键，这对发现新事物以及实现发现的目标至关重要。为了促进这一点，我们认为用户所见的内容多样性非常重要。一般来说，正如您提到的，行业内确实存在一些问题，有些不良分子在互联网上发布不良内容。对此，我们采取的措施是制定非常明确的社区准则。

We're very transparent about what is allowed and what is not allowed on our platform. No executives make any ad hoc decisions. And based on that, we have built a team that is tens of thousands of people, plus machines, in order to identify content that is bad and proactively remove it from the platform. Talk about what some of those key guidelines are. We have published on our website. We just, in March, we just iterated a new version to make it more readable. So there are many things like, for example, no pornography, clearly no child sexual abuse material and other bad things, no violence, for example.

我们对平台上允许和不允许的内容非常透明。没有任何高管会做出临时决定。基于这个原则，我们建立了一个由数万人和机器组成的团队，以识别不良内容并主动将其从平台上删除。关于一些关键的指导原则，我们已经在我们的网站上发布了相关信息。今年三月，我们刚更新了一个新版本，以便让内容更易读。例如，包括禁止色情内容、明确禁止儿童性虐待材料和其他恶劣内容，以及禁止暴力等。

We also make it clear that it's a differentiated experience if you're below 18 years old. So if you're below 18 years old, for example, your entire app experience is actually more restricted. We don't allow, as an example, users below 16, by default, the Go viral. We don't allow that. If you're below 16, we don't allow you to use the instant messaging feature in app. If you're below 18, we don't allow you to use the live streaming features. And of course, we give parents a whole set of tools to control their teenagers experience as well. How do you know the age of your users?

我们也明确表示，如果你未满18岁，你会体验到与成年人不同的使用感受。举个例子，如果你未满18岁，你在整个应用中的体验将会受到更多限制。默认情况下，我们不允许16岁以下的用户广泛传播内容。如果你未满16岁，我们不允许你使用应用内的即时通讯功能。如果你未满18岁，我们不允许你使用直播功能。当然，我们还为家长提供了一整套工具，帮助他们控制青少年的使用体验。你们如何知道用户的年龄呢？

In our industry, we rely mainly on something called age gating, which is when you sign up for the app for the first time, and we ask you for the age. Now, beyond that, we also have built tools to go through your public profile, for example, when you post a video. We try to match what the age that you said with the video that you just posted. Now, there are questions of, can we do more? And that question is always, has, for every company, by the way, in our industry, has to be balanced with privacy. Now, if, for example, we scan the faces of every single user, then we will significantly increase the ability to tell their age. But we will also significantly increase the amount of data that we collect on you. Now, we don't want to collect data. We don't want to scan data on your face to collect that. So that balance has to be maintained. And it's a challenge that we are working through it together with industry, together with regulators as well.

在我们的行业中，我们主要依赖一种叫做年龄限制的方法。当你第一次注册应用时，我们会询问你的年龄。除此之外，我们还开发了工具，可以检查你的公开资料，比如你发布的视频。我们会尝试将你所填写的年龄和你发布的视频进行匹配。现在，有一个问题是，能否做得更多？这个问题对我们行业中的每家公司来说，都必须在隐私和安全之间找到平衡。举个例子，如果我们扫描每个用户的脸，那么我们将大大提高判断其年龄的能力。但这样做也会显著增加我们收集的数据量。而我们并不想收集过多的数据，也不想通过扫描脸部来收集信息。所以这种平衡需要保持。这也是我们正在与行业和监管机构共同努力解决的一个挑战。

So, look, one thing that is unquestionable is that you have created a platform for literally millions of people who never thought they were going to be a content creator. You've given them an audience. I'd actually like to hear from you one of the favourite examples of someone who talk is given an audience to that never had that before. I think, you know, so again, you know, when I'm with, when I travel around the world, I need it for a whole bunch of creators on our platform. I was in South Korea just yesterday. And before that, you know, I met with. Yes.

所以，听着，有一件事是毋庸置疑的，就是你为数百万从未想过自己会成为内容创作者的人创造了一个平台。你为他们提供了观众。我其实挺想听你讲一个例子，关于某个人因为这个平台得到了观众，而以前从未有过这种机会。你知道的，每次我和平台上的创作者见面，尤其是我到世界各地旅行时，我能见到很多创作者。比如，我昨天刚在韩国，之前还见过。是的。

Before that, I met with a bunch of. People don't expect, for example, teachers. There is an English teacher from Arkansas. My name is Clovine. And I met her in person. She uses our platform to reach out to students. You know, there is another teacher called Chemical Kim. And Chemical Kim teaches chemistry. What she does is she uses our platform to reach out to a much broader student base than she has in her classroom. And they're both very, very popular. You know, in fact, what we have realised is that STEM content has over 116 billion views on our platform globally. And it's so significant. In a year? What? Kim, chemistry, 160 billion. It's so significant that in the US, we have started testing creating a feed just for STEM content, just for STEM content.

在那之前，我见过一群人。人们可能不会想到，举例来说，教师。其中有一位来自阿肯色州的英语老师，她叫Clovine，而且我亲自见过她。她使用我们的平台与学生联系。还有另一位老师叫Chemical Kim，教授化学。她利用我们的平台，接触到了比她课堂里面更多的学生，而且他们都非常受欢迎。实际上，我们发现全球范围内，STEM（科学、技术、工程和数学）内容在我们的平台上有超过1160亿次的观看量，这太重要了。一年内？什么？Kim，化学，160亿次。这个数据如此重要，以至于我们在美国已经开始测试专门针对STEM内容的独立订阅源。

I've been using it for a while, and I learned something new. You want to know what it is? Apparently, if you flip an egg, you know, on your tray, the egg will last longer. It's science. There's a whole video on this, you know? I learned this on TikTok. You can search for this. You want to know something else about an egg? If you put it in just one hand and squeeze it as hard as you can, it will never break. Yes, I think I read about that, too. It's not true. It's not true. But we can find it. You can search for it.

我用了一段时间，学到了新东西。你想知道是什么吗？据说，如果你把托盘上的鸡蛋翻个面，鸡蛋会保存得更久。这是有科学依据的，还有一个视频专门讲这个。我是在抖音上学到的，你可以搜搜看。你还想知道关于鸡蛋的另一件事吗？如果你单手拿着鸡蛋，用尽全力去捏，它是不会破的。是的，我好像也看过这个说法。其实不是真的，不是真的。但是我们可以找找看，你可以搜搜看。

But look, here's the flip side to all this amazingness. And it's really. Honestly, this is the key thing that I want to have an honest TikTok conversation with you, because it's such an important issue. This question of human addiction. You know, we are animals with a prefrontal cortex. That's how I think of us. We have these addictive instincts that go back millions of years. And we often are in the mode of trying to modulate our own, you know, behaviour. It turns out that the internet is incredibly good at activating our animal cells and getting them so damn excited. And your company, the company you've built, is better at it than any other company on the planet, I think.

但是看，这些令人惊叹的事情还有另一面。而且它真的很重要。说真的，这就是我想和你在TikTok上进行坦诚交流的关键问题，因为它是个非常重要的议题——关于人类的成瘾问题。你知道，我们是拥有前额叶皮层的动物，我就是这样看待我们的。我们有着可以追溯到数百万年前的成瘾本能。我们经常试图调节自己的行为。结果发现，互联网实在是太擅长激活我们的“动物细胞”了，让它们变得特别兴奋。而且你们公司，我认为，你们公司在这方面做得比地球上任何其他公司都要好。

So what are the risks of this? I mean, how. From a company point of view, for example, it's in your interest to have people on there as long as possible. So someone say is the first pass, you want people to be addicted as long as possible. That's how advertising money will flow and so forth. And that's how your creators will be delighted. What is too much? I don't actually agree with that. I, you know, as a company, our goal is not to optimise and maximise time spent. It is not. In fact, in order to address people spending too much time on our platform, we have done a number of things. I was just speaking with some of your colleagues backstage.

那么这里的风险是什么呢？我的意思是，从公司的角度来看，比如说，让人们在平台上停留的时间越长对你们越有利。有人说这是一种初步的看法，认为你们希望人们尽可能地上瘾，这样广告费就会源源不断地进来，创作者也会很高兴。那么什么才是适度呢？其实我并不同意这种看法。作为一家公司，我们的目标并不是优化和最大化用户在平台上花费的时间。事实上，为了应对人们在我们平台上花费过多时间的问题，我们已经采取了一系列措施。我刚刚还在后台与一些你的同事讨论这个问题。

One of them told me, you know, she hasn't counted this as well. If you spend too much time on our platform, we will proactively send you videos to tell you to get off the platform. We also, we will. And depending on the time of the day, if it's late at night, it will come sooner. We have also built in tools to limit, if it below 18 years old, by default, we set a 16-minute default time limit. How many? 60 minutes. Six, six, four. And we've given parents tools and your self tools. If you go to settings, you can set your own time limit. We've given parents tools so that you can pair it for the parents who don't know this.

其中一个人告诉我，你知道，她也没有仔细算过。如果你花太多时间在我们的平台上，我们会主动发送视频提醒你离开平台。我们确实会这样做。而且根据时间，如果是深夜，这些提醒会更早出现。我们还内置了工具，如果用户未满18岁，默认设置为60分钟的时间限制。六十分钟，对没错。我们也为家长提供了工具，你自己也有工具。如果你进入设置，可以设定自己的时间限制。我们为家长提供了工具，这样他们就可以帮孩子管理使用时间，对于那些不知道的家长们。

Go to settings, family pairing. You can pair your phone with your teenager's phone and set the time limit. And we really encourage parents to have these conversations with their teenagers on what is the right amount of screen time. I think that's a healthy relationship that you should have with your screen. And as a business, you know, we believe that that balance needs to be met. So it's not true that we just want to maximize time span. If you were advising parents here what time they should actually recommend to their teenagers, what do you think is the right setting? Well, 60 minutes, we did not come up with it ourselves. So I went to the digital wellness lab at the Boston Children's Hospital, and we had this conversation with them. And 60 minutes was the recommendation that they gave to us, which is why we built this into the app. Now, so 60 minutes, take it for what it is, you know, it's something that we've had some discussions of experts. But I think for all parents here, it is very important to have these conversations with your teenage children and, you know, help them develop a healthy relationship with screens. I think we live in an age where it's completely inevitable that we're going to interact with screens and, you know, digital content. But I think we should develop healthy habits early on in life. And that's something I would encourage.

进入设置，选择家庭配对。你可以将自己的手机与青少年的手机配对，并设定时间限制。我们非常鼓励家长与青少年进行关于合理屏幕时间的对话。我认为，这是一种你与屏幕之间应有的健康关系。作为一家公司，我们相信这种平衡是必要的，所以我们并不是仅仅想要最大化使用时间。如果你要为家长建议一个合适的时间设置，你觉得多长时间合适呢？ 实际上，60分钟并不是我们自己想出来的结果。我去了波士顿儿童医院的数字健康实验室，与他们进行了讨论，他们推荐60分钟，这也是我们把这个时间设置在应用中的原因。因此，60分钟是基于一些专家的讨论得出的结果。但我认为，对于所有家长来说，与青少年孩子进行这类对话非常重要，帮助他们建立健康的屏幕使用关系。我认为我们生活在一个必然会接触屏幕和数字内容的时代，但我们应该在生活早期就养成健康的习惯。这是我愿意鼓励的。

Curious to ask the audience of which of you here have ever had that video on TikTok appear, saying, come off. You see, over there? I mean, OK, so maybe a third of the audience seem to be active TikTok users, and about 20 people maybe put their hands up there. So it's, are you sure that, like, it feels to me like this is a great thing to have. But isn't there always going to be a temptation in any given quarter or whatever to just push it a bit at the boundary and just dial back a bit on that so that you can hit revenue goals, et cetera, et cetera? Is it, are you saying that this is used scriptulously? I think, you know, in terms, even if you think about it from a commercial point of view, it is always best when your customers have a very healthy relationship with your product. It's always best when it's healthy. So if you think about very short-term retention, maybe. But I don't think that's not the way we think about it. If you think about it from a longer-term perspective, what you really want to have is a healthy relationship. You don't want people to be, you know, to develop very unhealthy habits, and then at some point, they're going to drop it.

我想问问在座的观众，有多少人曾在抖音上看到过那种视频，提示你该休息一下？看到了吗？哦，看来大概有三分之一的观众是活跃的抖音用户，可能有大约20个人举起了手。所以，你们确定这真的是一件好事吗？但是否总会有一种诱惑，在某个时期或某个阶段，去尝试突破一下界限，为了达到收入目标而稍微放松一些限制呢？你是说这是被严格使用的吗？我认为，即使从商业角度来看，当顾客和你的产品保持健康的关系时，总是最好的。当关系是健康的，这总是最好的。因此，如果只考虑短期的用户留存率，可能是有利的。但我不认为这是我们的思考方式。从长期来看，你真正想要的是一种健康的关系。你不希望人们养成一些不健康的习惯，然后最终会放弃你。

Right. So I think everything in moderation. There's a claim out there that in China, there's a much more rigorous standards imposed on the amount of time that children, especially, can spend on the, you know, to talk about that. That is unfortunately a very, it's a misconception. So that experience that is being mentioned for Dauin, which is a different act, is for an under-14-year-old experience. Now, if you compare that in the United States, we have an under-13 experience in the US. It's only available in the US. It's not available here in Canada. In Canada, we just don't allow it. If you look at the under-13 experience in the US, it's much more restricted than the under-14 experience in China. It's so restrictive that every single piece of content is vetted by our third party's child safety expert. And we don't allow any under-13s in the US to publish. We don't allow them to post. And we don't allow them to use a lot of features. So I think that report, I've seen that report too. It's not doing a fair comparison. What do you make of this issue?

对。 我认为凡事适度。 有一种说法是，在中国，对儿童，特别是对他们在网上花费的时间，有更严格的标准。但不幸的是，这是一个误解。 所提到的那个体验是针对“抖音”(Dauin) 的，抖音是一个不同的应用程序，这个体验是针对14岁以下的儿童的。 现在，如果你拿美国来比较，美国有一个对13岁以下儿童的使用体验，但这个体验仅在美国提供，不在加拿大提供。在加拿大，我们不允许这样做。如果你看看美国的13岁以下体验，它比中国的14岁以下体验更受限制。它的限制程度是每一条内容都要经过第三方儿童安全专家的审核。我们不允许13岁以下的美国用户发布内容，也不允许他们发帖或使用许多功能。 所以我认为那个报告，我也看过那个报告，它没有进行公平的比较。你对这个问题怎么看？

You know, in a lot of you, you've got these millions of content creators, and all of them, in a sense, are in a race for attention. And that race can pull them in certain directions. So for example, teenage girls on TikTok, sometimes people worry that too win attention. They've discovered that by being more sexual, that they can gain extra viewers. Is this a concern? Is there anything you can do about this? We address this in our community guidelines as well. If you look at the sexualized content on our guidelines, if you're below a certain age, for certain themes that are mature, we actually remove that from your experience. Again, I come back to this. We want to have a safe platform. In fact, in my congressional hearing, I mean, four commitments to our users and to the politicians in the US. And one of the first ones is that we take safety, especially for teenagers, extremely seriously. And we will continue to prioritize that. I believe that we need to give our teenage users and our users in general a very safe experience. Because if we don't do that, then we cannot, the mission is to inspire creativity and to bring joy. If they don't feel safe, I cannot fulfill my mission. So it's all very organic to me as a business to make sure I do that.

你知道，现在有成千上万的内容创作者，他们都在争夺观众的注意力。而这种竞争会将他们引向某些特定的方向。举个例子，TikTok上的一些青少女为了赢得关注，可能会发现通过展示更性感的内容可以吸引更多的观众。这会引起人们的担忧。对此，我们在社区指南中有明确规定。如果你年龄较小，对于某些成熟主题的内容，我们实际上会将其从你的体验中删除。我们希望平台是安全的。在我的国会听证会上，我曾向用户和美国政界人士做出过四项承诺，而其中首要的就是我们会非常重视安全，特别是青少年的安全，我们会继续将其作为优先事项。我相信，我们需要为青少年用户和所有用户提供一个非常安全的体验。因为如果我们做不到这一点，我们就无法实现启发创造力和带来快乐的使命。如果用户感受不到安全，我就无法完成我的使命。所以，确保安全对我而言是一件非常自然的事。

But in the strange interacting world of human psychology and so forth, weird memes can take off. I mean, you had this outbreak, a copy us back with these devious licks, where kids were competing with each other to do vandalism in schools and get lots of followers from it. How would that help you battle something like that? So dangerous challenges are not allowed on our platform. If you look at our guidelines, it's violative. We proactively invest resources to identify them and remove them from our platform. In fact, if you search for dangerous challenges on our platform today, we will redirect you to a safety resource page. And we actually worked with some creators as well to come up with campaigns.

但在人类心理学及其他方面相互作用的奇怪世界里，奇怪的模因会流行起来。比如之前出现了一种名为“恶作剧挑战”的模因，孩子们为了在学校搞破坏并获得大量关注，互相竞争。你怎么能应对这种情况呢？我们平台上是不允许这种危险挑战的。如果你查看我们的指南，就会发现这是违反规定的。我们积极投入资源来识别并移除这些内容。实际上，如果你今天在我们的平台上搜索危险挑战，我们会把你重定向到一个安全资源页面。我们还与一些创作者合作，推出了一些活动。

This is another campaign. It's the Stop, Think, Decide Before You Act campaign, where we work with the creators to produce videos, to explain to people that some of the things are dangerous, please don't do it. And we post this video actively on our platform as well. That's cool. And you've got lots of employees. I mean, how many employees do you have who are specifically looking at these content moderation things? Or is that the wrong question? Is it, are they mostly identified by AI initially, and then you have a group who are overseeing and making the final decision?

这是另一个活动。这个活动叫做“停下来、思考、在行动前做决定”活动，我们与创作者合作制作视频，向人们解释一些事情是危险的，请不要去做。我们也会积极在我们的平台上发布这些视频。这很酷。你们有很多员工，我是说，你们有多少员工专门负责这些内容审核的工作？或者我该问的是，这些内容大部分是先由人工智能识别的，然后再有一个团队负责监督并做最终决定？

The group is based in Ireland. And it's a lot of people. It's tens of thousands of people. Tens of thousands. It's a huge, it's one of the most important cost items on my P&L. And I think it's completely worth it. Now, most of the moderation has to be done by machines. The machines are good. They're quite good. But they're not as good as, you know, they're not perfect at this point. So you have to compliment them with a lot of human beings today. And I think, by the way, a lot of the progress in AI, in general, is making that kind of content moderation capabilities a lot better.

這個團隊總部位於愛爾蘭，而且有很多人，數萬人之多。數萬人，這是一個非常龐大的團隊，也是我損益表中最重要的成本項目之一。我認為這完全是值得的。現在，大部分的內容審核需要由機器完成。這些機器效果很好，非常好，但還沒有達到完美。因此，目前仍需要大量人力來補充機器的不足。我認為，順便說一下，整體上的人工智能進步，使得這類內容審核能力變得更好了。

So we're going to be more precise. We're going to get more specific. And it's going to be able to handle larger scale. And that's something I think that I'm personally looking forward to. What about this perceived, huge downside of use of, certainly Instagram, I think TikTok as well? What people worry that you are amplifying insecurities, especially of teenagers, and perhaps especially of teenage girls, that you see these amazing people on there doing amazing things. They feel inadequate. There's all these reported cases of depression, insecurity, suicide, and so forth.

所以我们会更加精确。我们会变得更加具体。并且这将能够处理更大规模的情况。而且我个人对此非常期待。至于人们所认为的巨大负面影响，尤其是在使用Instagram和TikTok时，人们担心你们在放大不安全感，尤其是青少年，特别是少女，看到平台上那些了不起的人在做了不起的事，她们会感到自卑。有很多关于抑郁、不安全感、自杀等的报道。

I take this extremely seriously. So again, in our guidelines for certain themes that we think are mature and not suitable for teenagers, we actually proactively remove it from their experience. At the same time, if you search certain terms, we will make sure that you get redirected to a resource safety page. Now, we're always working with experts to understand some of these new trends that could emerge and proactively try to manage them. Does that make sense? Now, this is a problem that predates us. That predates TikTok. It actually predates the internet. But it's our responsibility to make sure that we invest enough, to understand, and to address the concerns, to keep their experience as safe as possible for as many people as possible.

我对此非常认真。因此，在我们的指南中，对于某些我们认为成熟且不适合青少年的主题，我们会主动将其从他们的使用体验中移除。同时，如果你搜索某些关键词，我们会确保你被重定向到一个资源安全页面。我们一直在与专家合作，了解可能出现的一些新趋势，并主动进行管理。明白吗？这个问题在我们之前就存在了，比TikTok还早，其实比互联网还早。但我们有责任确保投入足够的资源，了解并解决这些问题，尽可能多地让他们的使用体验保持安全。

Now, in Congress, the main concern seemed to be not so much what we've talked about. But data, the data, of users, the fact that you're owned by a bike dance, Chinese company, and the concern that at any moment, Chinese government might require or ask for data. And in fact, there have been instances where I think you've confirmed that some data of journalists on the platform was made available to bike dancers, engineers, and from there, who knows what. Now, your response to this was to have this project Texas, where you're moving data to be controlled by Oracle here in the US. Can you talk about that project, and why, if you believe it's so, why we should not worry so much about this issue?

现在，在国会中，主要关注的似乎并不是我们之前讨论过的内容，而是数据，用户数据。因为你们公司被一家中国企业字节跳动拥有，人们担心中国政府可能随时要求或获取这些数据。而事实上，确实发生过几次你们确认过的情况，即一些在平台上的记者数据被字节跳动的工程师获取了，之后会发生什么就不得而知了。对此，你们提出了“德州计划”，将数据转移到美国由Oracle控制。你能谈谈这个项目吗？以及，为什么如果你认为可以的话，我们不必过于担心这个问题？

I will see a couple of things about this, if you don't mind. The first thing I would say is that the internet is built on global interoperability. And we are not the only company that relies on the global talent pool to make our products as good as. The technology is a very collaborative effort. I think many people here would say the same thing. So we are not the first company to have engineers in all countries, including in China. We're not the first one. Now, I understand some of these concerns. So the data access by employees is not data access by government. This is very different. And there's a clear difference in this. But we hear the concerns that are raised in the United States.

如果你不介意的话，我想说几句话。首先我要说的是，互联网建立在全球互操作性的基础上。我们并不是唯一依靠全球人才库来改进产品的公司。技术是一个非常需要合作的领域。我认为这里很多人都会认同这一点。所以我们不是第一个在包括中国在内的所有国家都有工程师的公司。我们并不是第一个。现在，我理解一些担忧。但员工访问数据与政府访问数据是不同的。这之间有明确的区别。不过，我们也听到了在美国提出的这些担忧。

We did not try to avoid discussing. Or we did not try to argue our way out of it. What we did was we built an unprecedented project, where we localized American data to be stored on American soil by an American company, overseen by American personnel. So this kind of protection for American data is beyond what any other company, or industry has ever done. Well, money is not the only issue here, but it's very expensive to build something like that. And more importantly, we are basically localizing data in a way that no other company has done. So we need to be very careful that whilst we are pursuing data, what we call digital sovereignty in the US, and we're also doing a version of this in Europe, that we don't bulkenize the internet.

我们并没有试图避免讨论，也没有试图争论摆脱这个问题。我们所做的是建立了一个前所未有的项目，把美国的数据本地化，存储在美国的土地上，由一家美国公司管理，并由美国人员监督。因此，这种对美国数据的保护超出了任何其他公司或行业所做的事情。尽管资金并不是唯一的问题，但建立这样的项目是非常昂贵的。更重要的是，我们实际上是在以一种没有其他公司做过的方式本地化数据。因此，我们需要非常谨慎，在追求所谓的美国的数字主权时，同时我们也在欧洲做类似的事情，我们不能让互联网割裂。

Now, we are the first to do it. And I expect that other companies are probably looking at this and trying to figure out how you balance between protecting, protected data, to make sure that everybody feels secure about it, while at the same time allowing for interoperability to continue to happen. Because that's what makes technology and the internet so great. So that's something that we are. How far are you along that journey with Project Texas? We are very, very far along today. When will there be a clear, here it is, it's done. It's far more. The state is protected. Today, by default, all new US data is already stored in the Oracle Cloud infrastructure.

现在，我们是第一个做到这一点的公司。我预计其他公司可能也在关注这一点，并试图找到一种平衡的方法，既能保护数据的安全，确保大家对数据感到安全，同时也能继续实现互操作性。因为这正是技术和互联网如此伟大的原因。那么我们处在这个旅程的什么阶段呢？在德州项目上，我们已经走得很远了。何时能明确地说，这件事已经完成了呢？如今，美国所有的新数据默认都会存储在Oracle云基础设施中。这大大提高了数据的安全性。

So it's in this protected US environment that we talked about in the United States. We still have some legacy data to delete in our own service in Virginia and in Singapore. Our data has never been stored in China, by the way. That deletion is a very big engineering effort. So as I said that the hearing is going to take us a while to delete them, but I expect it to be done this year. How much power do you have of your own ability to control certain things? So for example, suppose that for whatever reason, the Chinese government was to look at an upcoming US election and say, you know what? We would like this party to win, let's say, or we would like civil war to break out or whatever.

我们之前提到，这些数据是存储在美国受保护的环境中的。我们确实还有一些遗留数据需要删除，这些数据存储在我们位于弗吉尼亚州和新加坡的服务器上。另外，我要强调的是，我们的数据从未存储在中国。删除这些数据需要大量的工程工作。正如我之前所说，完成这些删除工作需要一些时间，但我预计今年可以完成。那么，你在控制某些事情的能力方面有多大的权力？例如，假设中国政府由于某种原因关注即将举行的美国选举，并且希望某个政党获胜，或者希望引发内战之类的情况。

How? And we could do this by amplifying the content of certain trouble-making, disturbing people, causing uncertainty, spreading misinformation, et cetera. How if you were required via ByteDance to do this? Like, first of all, is there a pathway where theoretically that's possible? What's your personal line in the sound on this? So during the congressional hearing, I made four commitments. We talked about the first one, which is safety. The third one is to keep TikTok a place of freedom or expression.

怎么做呢？我们可以通过放大某些惹麻烦、让人不安、制造不确定性、传播错误信息等人的内容来达到这个目的。如果字节跳动要求你这样做呢？首先，理论上有可能这样做的途径吗？在这方面，你的个人底线是什么？在国会听证会上，我做了四个承诺。我们讨论了第一个承诺，那就是安全。第三个承诺是保持TikTok作为表达自由的场所。

By the way, if you go and TikTok today, you can search for anything you want, as long as it doesn't violate our community guidelines and to keep it free from any government manipulation. And the fourth one is transparency and third-party monitoring. So the way we are trying to address this concern is an unprecedented amount of transparency. What do I mean by this? We're actually allowing third-party reviewers to come in and review our source code. I don't know any other company that does this, by the way. Just so, because everything, as you know, is driven by code.

顺便说一下，如果你今天去用 TikTok，可以搜索你想要的任何内容，只要不违反我们的社区准则，并且确保不受任何政府操控。第四点是透明度和第三方监控。我们应对这些问题的方式是前所未有的透明度。我的意思是什么呢？实际上，我们允许第三方评审人员来检查我们的源代码。据我所知，没有其他公司这样做。因为你知道，一切都是由代码驱动的。

So to allow someone else to review the source code is to give this a significant amount of transparency to ensure that the scenarios that you described, that are highly hypothetical, cannot happen on our platform. Now, at the same time, we are releasing more research tools for researchers so that they can study the output. So the source code is the input. We are also allowing researchers to study the output, which is the content on our platform. I think the easiest way to sort of defend this office is transparency. We give people access to monitor us, and we can just make it very, very transparent.

让别人审查源代码，可以极大程度地提高透明度，从而确保你所描述的那些高度假设的情况不会在我们的平台上发生。与此同时，我们也在为研究人员发布更多的研究工具，以便他们研究输出内容。所以源代码是输入，我们也允许研究人员研究输出内容，也就是平台上的内容。我认为，最简单的自我保护方法就是透明。我们让人们能够监督我们，并让这一切变得非常非常透明。

And that's our approach to the problem. So you will say directly to this group that the scenario I talked about of Chinese, theoretical Chinese government interference in an American election, you can say that will not happen? I can say that we are building all the tools to prevent any of these actions from happening. And I'm very confident that with an unprecedented amount of transparency that we're giving on the platform, we can reduce this risk to as low as zero as possible. To as low as zero as possible. To as close to zero as possible. As close to zero as possible. That's fairly reassuring, fairly. I mean, how would the world know? And what would, like, if you discovered this, or you thought you had to do it, is this a line in the sand for you? Are you a sit-rate? You would not let the company that you know now and that you are running do this.

这就是我们对这个问题的应对方法。所以，你会直接告诉这个群体，我之前提到的关于中国政府理论上干预美国选举的情况，你能说这种情况不会发生吗？我可以说，我们正在构建所有工具，以防止任何此类行为的发生。而且我非常有信心，通过在平台上前所未有的透明度，我们可以将这种风险降低到尽可能接近零。尽可能接近零。这相当令人放心。我的意思是，世界会怎么知道呢？如果你发现了这种情况，或者认为必须采取行动，这对你来说是明确的界限吗？你会坚决不让你现在所知并管理的公司去做这种事。

Absolutely. That's the reason why we're letting third parties monitor this. Because if they find out, they will disclose this. We also have transparency reports, by the way, where we talked about a whole bunch of things. The content that we remove, that violates our guidelines, government requests, it's all published online. What do you have to do a search for? So you're super compelling and likeable as a CEO, I have to say. I would like to, as we wrap this up, I'd like to give you a chance just to paint. But what's the vision? What, as you look at what TikTok could be, let's move the clock out, say five years from now, what, how should we think about your contribution to our collective future?

当然。这就是为什么我们让第三方来监督这件事的原因。因为如果他们发现什么问题，他们会公开披露。此外，我们还有透明报告，里面讨论了很多事情。我们移除的违反指南的内容、政府要求的信息，全部都在线上公布。只需要搜索一下就能找到。作为CEO，你真的很有魅力和吸引力，我不得不说。在总结之前，我想给你一个机会，让你描绘一下未来的愿景。当你展望TikTok的未来，假设五年后，你希望我们如何看待你对我们共同未来的贡献？

I think it's still down to the vision that we have. So in terms of the window of discovery, I think there's a huge benefit to the world. When people can discover new things. You know, people think that TikTok is all about dancing and singing, and there's nothing wrong with that. Because it's super fun. There's still a lot of that, but we're seeing science content, STEM content, we're seeing, have you heard about BookTalk? It's a viral trend that talks about books and encourages people to read. That BookTalk has 120 billion views globally, 120 billion. Billion with a B. People are learning how to cook, people are learning, people are learning about science, people are learning how to golf, well, people are watching videos on golfing, I guess.

我认为这归根结底还是我们的愿景问题。就发现的窗口期而言，我认为这对世界有很大的好处。当人们能发现新事物时，他们会从中受益。你知道的，人们通常认为TikTok只是关于跳舞和唱歌的，但这没什么不对，因为那真的很有趣。虽然这个内容仍然很多，但我们现在也看到了科学内容、STEM（科学、技术、工程和数学）内容。你听说过BookTalk（书籍小视频）吗？这是一种鼓励人们阅读的病毒式趋势。在全球范围内，BookTalk的视频已经有1200亿次浏览，没错，是1200亿次，以B开头的“亿”。人们正在学习做饭，学习各种知识，学习科学，学习打高尔夫球，嗯，人们正在看高尔夫球的视频，我想是这样的。

I'm ticked by this. I haven't gotten better. I'm ticked by this. I think there's a huge, huge opportunity here on discovery and giving the everyday person a voice. If you talk to our creators, you know, a lot of people will tell you this again and again, that before TikTok, they will never have been discovered. And we have given them the platform to do that. It is important to maintain that. Then we talk about creation. You know, there's all these new technology coming in. With AI generative content, that will help people create even more creative content. I think there's going to be a collaboration between, and I think there's a speaker who's going to talk about this, but then people in AI, where they can unleash their creativity in a different way. You know, like, for example, I'm terrible at drawing, personally. But if I had some AI to help me, then maybe I can express myself even better. Then we talk about bridges to connect and connecting people and the communities together.

这让我有些恼火。我还没有变得更好。这让我有些恼火。我认为在发现和给予普通人发声的机会方面，有一个巨大的机会。如果你和我们的创作者交谈，很多人会一再告诉你，在TikTok出现之前，他们从未被发现过。而我们为他们提供了实现这一点的平台。保持这一点非常重要。然后我们谈到创作。你知道，有很多新技术正在出现。生成型AI内容将帮助人们创造更多富有创意的内容。我认为这里会有一种合作，并且我认为有位演讲者会谈到这个话题，这种合作将是在人们与AI之间，他们可以用不同的方式释放他们的创造力。比如，我个人绘画很糟糕。但是如果有AI帮助我，那么也许我可以更好地表达自己。然后我们谈到连接和桥梁，连接人与人以及社区。

This could be products, this could be commerce, five million businesses in the US benefit from TikTok today. I think we can get the number to a much higher number. And of course, if you look around the world, including in Canada, that number is going to be massive. So I think these are the biggest opportunities that we have. And it's really very exciting. So courtesy of your experience in Congress, you actually became a bit of a TikTok star yourself, I think. Some of your videos have gone viral. How about, you've got your phone with you. Do you want to make a little TikTok video right now? The audience doesn't have to. If you don't mind, what do you think? We're just going to do a selfie together. How's that? OK. So what do we just say? Hi. Hi. Hello from Ted. All right, thank you. I hope it goes viral. If that one goes viral, I think I've given up on your algorithm, actually. I think it's going to take better. Shochu, you're one of the most influential and powerful people in the world, whether you know it or not. And I really appreciate you coming and sharing your vision. I really, really hope the upside of what you're talking about comes about. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

这可能是产品，也可能是商业。美国有五百万企业从TikTok中受益。我认为我们可以将这个数字提高到更高的水平。当然，如果你环顾世界，包括加拿大，这个数字会非常巨大。所以我认为这是我们最大的机会，真的非常令人兴奋。凭借你在国会的经验，你实际上也成了一个TikTok明星。我认为你的一些视频已经病毒式传播了。你有手机在身边。要不要现在做个TikTok视频？观众不必参与。如果你不介意，你觉得怎么样？我们只需要一起自拍，怎么样？好吧，那我们说什么呢？嗨。嗨。Ted问候大家。好了，谢谢。我希望这个视频能病毒式传播。如果这个视频能火了，我会放弃对你的算法的抱怨。我想它会表现得更好。Shochu，你是世界上最有影响力和权力的人之一，无论你是否意识到这一点。我真的很感谢你来分享你的愿景。我真的希望你所说的好结果能实现。非常感谢。谢谢。谢谢。谢谢你。谢谢。