56 Minutes of Money Wisdom for High-Earning Couples
发布时间 2025-01-06 13:55:00 来源
50% of couples who talk to me do not know their household income. Money for most is not a source of connection, it's a wedge. I want to go keep on this, this is actually cool. In most relationships there is one money person. And this is a huge mistake. How do you get someone who is a warrior to start spending? You need to learn the skill of managing money, but you also need to learn the skill of spending money meaning. Tell me what to do. I have seven quick steps, it's very easy. First off. Alright, we're live, we're meat. So the reason I wanted to have you on was because Sean and I were talking the other day. And at the end of the episode, at like minute 55, we got to the total end, and somehow it came up that my wife, Sarah and I, we do this thing that we just call our monthly money meeting.
50% 约与我交谈的伴侣都不了解他们的家庭收入。对大多数人来说，金钱不是一种联结的方式，而是导致分裂的原因。我想继续探讨这个话题，这其实很有趣。在大多数关系中，总是有一个人负责理财。这是一个巨大的错误。如何让一个勤俭节约的人开始花钱？需要学习管理金钱的技巧，但也需要学习有意义地花钱的技能。告诉我该怎么做。我有七个简单步骤，非常容易。首先。我们开始了，我们面对面。所以我想邀请你来的原因是因为我和肖恩前几天在讨论。在那集节目的最后，大约在第55分钟，我们聊到了一个尽头，然后不知怎么谈到我和妻子萨拉做的一件事，我们称之为每月的财务会议。
And the way it works is that we like break down our monthly expenses, our income, and we also look at our network and we talk about how can we spend the next month to like make ourselves happier? Like, how can we use like money as a tool? And are we happy with our consumption and whatever the previous month? Sean made fun of me and he was like, that's the right, you're running that like a corporation, like a business. And at first I was embarrassed to say that I'm running my marriage like a business. And then afterwards I was like, actually no, like I can love my wife and that's the number one reason why I do this. And also in order to make it run effectively, you kind of have to run a tight ship like a business or have like business attributes.
我们的做法是，我们会分解我们的每月开支、收入，并查看我们的净资产，然后讨论如何在下个月的花销上让自己更快乐。就是说，如何把钱当作工具来使用？我们是否对上个月的消费以及现状感到满意？Sean取笑我，说我这样做就像在经营一家公司、一个企业。起初，我对自己把婚姻经营得像个企业感到尴尬。不过之后我意识到，其实没什么不好，我这样做主要是因为我爱我的妻子。而且为了让事情有效运转，你确实需要有企业经营的一些特点，把事情安排得井井有条。
And you have this book Money for Couples and you tweet all about this, the stuff with your relationships and running it like a business. And I thought you should come on and kind of talk about the other stuff of a relationship other than love, which requires running it a little bit like a business. Well, first of all, I appreciate that Sean makes fun of you. That's one of my favorite parts of this pod. But when you are married, you are running a business. It is the business of running a household together. And it's only in the last 100 or so years that Americans became infatuated with this idea of love as the only reason to get married. That's ahistorical. That's not been the case for a long time.
这段话翻译成中文并尽量易读的版本是：
你有一本书叫《情侣理财》，你在推特上发布了很多关于这本书的内容，涉及你们的关系以及像经营企业一样经营关系的方式。我觉得你应该来谈谈关系中除了爱情之外的其他部分，这需要我们像经营企业一样去管理。首先，我很欣赏Sean取笑你，这是我最喜欢这个播客的一部分。但是，当你结婚了，你实际上是在经营一个“企业”，这个企业就是共同经营家庭。只有在过去的一百多年里，美国人开始痴迷于“爱情是结婚的唯一理由”这个观念，但这在历史上并不是普遍的情况。
And just to give you an example, it's so culturally dependent. My parents knew each other seven days before they got married. So you have to remember that it's not unromantic to talk about money. I actually find it very romantic that you are building a connection. And there's a whole bunch of other benefits that I'm sure you and I both experience because we talk about money regularly. You got this amazing podcast and a lot of the people, you have some really wealthy people. I think you had someone who is making like two or three million dollars a year and they talked about spending. But I think your typical bread and butter is low-ish six figures. But our audience makes like, I'm going to just make up the sabotage of like two to $400,000 a year and they work at tech companies.
翻译如下：
给你举个例子，这真的是与文化背景密切相关的。我父母在结婚前只认识了七天。所以你得记住，谈论钱并不浪漫。但在我看来，通过这样的交流建立联系其实非常浪漫。此外，我们通过定期谈论金钱得到了一系列好处，我相信你和我都能感受到。你有一个很棒的播客，嘉宾中有很多非常富有的人。我记得有一个嘉宾年收入大概两三百万美元，他们还谈到了花钱的事情。不过，我认为你的核心听众年收入大概是低六位数。我们的听众群体则大概是年薪二到四十万美元之间，多数在科技公司工作。
I think this topic is so fascinating to me because it cuts across psychology, numbers, communication. And I personally think it's underexplored. I think there's a lot of people online who talk about how to make money, how to invest money. Very few people talk about how to spend it meaningfully. And even fewer talk about how to do it in a relationship. So if you're listening and you're single or dating or you've been married for 20 years, odds are very likely that you have not substantively talked about money with your partner. And it's important. It is, it's one of the core things in a relationship. That's why I love talking about this.
我觉得这个话题对我来说非常吸引人，因为它涉及心理学、数字和沟通。我个人认为这个领域还未被充分探索。网上有很多人讨论如何赚钱、如何投资，但很少有人谈论如何有意义地花钱，更少有人讨论在关系中如何做到这一点。所以如果你正在收听这个内容，无论你是单身、在约会中，还是结婚已有20年，很可能你还没有和伴侣深入地讨论过金钱问题。而这是很重要的，它是关系中的一个核心方面。这就是为什么我喜欢谈论这个话题的原因。
Do you remember Tim Ferris in the four hour work week? He had this thing called like the dream scenario or something. It's very similar to the stuff that you do. It's something like write down all of the things you want to own and then like reverse engineer it to figure out how much do you have to earn in order to afford this and like just like be intentional about what you want and specifically say it and work backwards towards it. So I used to do that as a 22 year old. I think I had like at one point I've owned everything that was on that list. And I was like, oh, like half that list. I don't really give a shit about even after I owned it.
你还记得《每周工作四小时》中的蒂姆·费里斯吗？他提出了一个叫做“梦想情境”的概念。这和你做的事情很相似，差不多就是写下你想拥有的所有东西，然后逆向分析一下，你需要赚多少钱才能负担得起这些。就是要有意识地去思考你真正想要什么，并具体表达出来，然后朝这个方向努力。我22岁的时候也这么做过。我想我曾经把清单上的所有东西都买过。然而，在拥有了一半的东西后，我发现自己其实并不怎么在乎它们。
But I remember a year into dating my wife. It was like, hey, this is promising. It appears we're going to like this is going towards marriage, which is great. And we did that dream lining together. And we used to do it all the time where it was like, tell me like what's your ideal like life scenario? Like what would you, how would you like to live? And like, let's like how much would that require? Like what responsibilities are you willing to take and what should I take on? It was so helpful to do that early on in a relationship. And it sounds weird, but it was like a great conversation. I love that. It's amazing that the two of you did that early on because it's one thing to do it solo. It's an entirely another thing to do with a partner. But what's amazing is that you two were on the same page of even talking about that. You have to remember most couples, they're not like that.
我记得跟我妻子约会一年后，我们的关系逐渐有了希望，看起来正朝着结婚的方向发展，这很棒。我们曾经一起做过理想生活的规划，常常聊到彼此梦想的生活状况，想要怎样的生活方式，需要多少资源来支撑，以及各自愿意承担哪些责任。这对于早期的关系真的非常有帮助。尽管听起来有些奇怪，但这确实是一场很棒的对话。我很喜欢那种体验。令人惊讶的是，你们俩在关系初期就进行了这样的讨论，因为一个人去做这件事和和伴侣一起去做是完全不同的。而最棒的是，你们竟能在谈论这些事情上达成共识。要记住，大多数情侣并不会这样做。
They're not sitting down to dream. One person is probably a warrior. Another person might be an avoider or probably for the people listening, they're optimizers, spreadsheet freaks who love to look at compound interest all the time. And they're not even communicating in the same way. So one person is like, look at our returns, look at our net worth. And the other's like, why are you talking about this? Like, I don't think we're going to have enough. Why did you spend $20 at the gas station? So you guys were speaking the same language. Most couples, not even in the same planet when it comes to money. Optimizers, what is that? Oh, there's four money types.
他们不是坐下来做梦的那种。有的人可能是个战士，有的人可能是个逃避者，对听众来说，他们可能是优化者，是那些喜欢不停查看复利的表格狂热爱好者。他们的沟通方式完全不同。一方可能会说：“看看我们的收益，看看我们的净资产。”而另一方则会说：“你为什么要谈这些？我觉得我们不够用。为什么你在加油站花了20美元？” 你们说的是同一种语言，而大多数情侣在谈论金钱时，几乎不在同一个星球上。优化者是什么？哦，原来有四种“金钱类型”。
I talk about them in my book. I talked to thousands and thousands of people and I found these four types that describe a lot of people. First, avoider. This is the most common. They avoid money. They do a series of conscious and unconscious techniques to do it. If they're in a relationship, they'll say stuff like, you're just better at money. I'm not good at math. Sometimes they even sabotage conversations by saying stuff like, why do you always have to talk about money? Can't we just have a good time? That's an avoider. And there's a whole bunch of techniques that you can use to not be an avoider or to have a partner that's an avoider. Then we have optimizer. That is me. That's you. That's a lot of people listening. Optimizers, you know, they can do a lot of good because they're saving, they're investing. The problem is you take it to the logical extreme and they become incredibly boring and cheap. All they care about is the cost. We shouldn't buy this Coke can because if we compounded that for 45 years, it would actually be $1,200. It's like, get a life.
我在书中讨论了他们。我和成千上万的人交流后，发现了四种类型的人，这些类型能代表很多人。首先是"回避者"。这是最常见的一种。他们回避谈论金钱，并使用一系列有意识或无意识的技巧来做到这一点。如果他们在一段关系中，会说类似“你更擅长理财”，“我数学不好”之类的话。有时他们甚至会通过说“为什么你总是要谈钱？我们不能开开心心的吗？”来破坏对话。这就是"回避者"。有很多技巧可以帮助你不成为"回避者"或者如何与"回避者"的伴侣相处。接下来是"优化者"。那是我，是你，是很多在听的人。优化者做了很多好事，比如存钱和投资。但问题是，他们把事情推向了极端，变得无聊又吝啬。他们只关心花费。他们会说：“我们不应该买这个可乐，因为如果把这笔钱复利45年，可以变成1200美元。” 真是太过于算计了。
Optimizers are really hard to be partners with because they always go, how much does it cost? That's all they're concerned with. But they can change as well. We have warriors. Warriors worry about everything. In fact, many of them saw that growing up. And when I asked them, what would it look like if you didn't worry about money? They have no idea because that's all they have ever known. And finally, dreamers. Dreamers believe that success is just around the corner. Dreamers, it's the next gig. It's the next deal. These are the folks who typically fall into get rich quick schemes. And they are incredibly difficult to be partners with. They're not listening. They're not reading my book. Let's put it that way. And the only reason they can live in La La Land is that they are often subsidized by someone else, often their partner. Those are the four money types.
翻译为中文，并尽量易读：
和优化者做伙伴真的很难，因为他们总是问，这要花多少钱？这就是他们关心的一切。但他们也可以改变。我们还有战士。战士们什么都担心。事实上，他们中的许多人从小就是这样。当我问他们，如果不担心钱会是什么样子时，他们根本不知道，因为他们从小就认识这些。最后是梦想家。梦想家相信成功就在眼前。对于梦想家来说，是下一个工作，是下一笔交易。他们通常容易被快速发财的骗局吸引。与他们做伙伴也非常困难。他们不听建议，也不看我的书。可以这么说。他们之所以能活在幻想中，只是因为常常有其他人，通常是他们的伴侣，在资助他们。这就是四种金钱类型。
You seem like you teach this stuff. So I assume, and I know you, so I know it's true, that you have your act together when it comes to money. And if you are, you're an optimizer now, you said, what flaws do you still have? And how do they present itself on a daily basis? Yeah. For everyone listening, Sam was like, we're texting. And Sam was like, hey, what are you getting on Black Friday? And I was like, I don't shop any place that does Black Friday sales. And that's the difference. But the fact is, you're an optimizer. So am I. They just manifest in different ways. So where do yours manifest in ways that are good, but also in annoying ways? Dude, the annoying ways are the ones that when I was 22, it was all about life. Look at these numbers. You just need to do this. It's so easy. It's so clear. And then I could see people's eyes glazing over, but I didn't know why.
你似乎是教这些东西的。所以我猜测，而且因为我了解你，我知道这是真的，你在理财方面很有一套。既然如此，你现在是个优化大师，你说说你还有哪些缺点呢？这些缺点在日常生活中是如何表现出来的？对了，我们在聊天时，Sam说：“黑色星期五你打算买些什么？”我回答说：“我不在任何有黑色星期五促销的地方购物。”这就是我们的区别。但实际上，我们都是优化大师，只是表现方式不同。那么你的优点和让人困扰的地方分别是哪些呢？让我困扰的地方是，在我22岁的时候，生活就是这样：看看这些数字，你只需要这样做，这样做，这么简单清晰。但我发现人们听到后眼神飘忽，却不知道为什么。
And once you get a little bit older, a little bit more mature, a little bit better skill, the communicating, you realize nobody wants to be talked to like that. And in fact, like in the areas where I have been really weak, like fitness, where I didn't grow up knowing what protein was until my late 20s, if someone was like, dude, it's so simple. Doo, doo, doo, doo, doo, doo. It would have been overwhelming and it would have made me feel stupid. So I learned how to slow down, become a little bit more emotionally connective, but dude, it's still there. When I'm talking about money, sometimes I'm like, okay, I get it. Let's get to the part where we do the numbers. And it happens regularly. My wife and I have monthly money meetings. We have our annual rich life review. And I can see it in myself. I just want to get to the end because for me, you know, I was raised like, efficiency is a virtue. Getting to that part is a virtue. And I've had to really try to learn and I'm still learning. Sometimes slow it down, take the journey, have fun along the way. We'll get there, but don't be in a rush to get where we're going to get anyway.
当你年纪稍微大一点，成熟一点，沟通技巧更好时，你会意识到没有人愿意被这样说话。实际上，在我很弱的领域，比如健身，我直到二十多岁才知道蛋白质是什么，如果有人说，哥们，这太简单了，搞得就像是：这样、这样、这样、这样，那会让我觉得不知所措，让我觉得自己很笨。所以我学会了放慢脚步，更加情感地交流，但老兄，这种冲动仍然在。当我谈论金钱时，有时我心里想，好，我明白了，快到我们做数字的部分吧。这种情况经常发生。我的妻子和我每月都有财务会议，每年还有一次财富生活审查。我能看到我自己的急切，因为对我来说，我从小就被教育效率是一种美德，快速达到目标是一种美德。我不得不努力学习，仍在学习，有时放慢脚步，享受过程中的乐趣。我们会到达目的地，但不要急着到达本来就能到达的地方。
What's this? You know, it's December 30th when we're filming this. What's the annual review? Oh, man, we're in the middle of it right now. So this is like one of my favorite times of the year. So in every December, we have an annual rich life review. And I would encourage everybody to do this. So we sit down and we do it over several days. We're in no rush. And we start off by just going through our photos from the year and we go, like what were our most memorable things that happened this year? And a lot of them are favorites, but some of them are not so good. You know, things that just bring up visceral memories. You're talking about like a death or something like that. Yeah. Something bad that happened, but a lot of good things. Travel we did, family we saw, things like that. And you just know it when you see it. You just know it. And looking over our photos, what we do is we just put like 10, 20 and we text into each other and we talk about it.
这是什么？你知道，我们是在12月30号拍摄这个视频的。这是年度回顾吗？天哪，我们现在正忙于这个过程呢。这是一年中我最喜欢的时刻之一。在每年十二月，我们会做一个年度“丰盛生活”回顾。我鼓励每个人都去做这个。我们会坐下来，用几天的时间做这个，不赶时间。我们一开始会翻看自己这一年的照片，回忆今年发生的最难忘的事情。很多事情都是愉快的，但有些事情不太好。你知道，还有一些带来强烈记忆的事情，比如有人去世或者其他不好的事情。但也有很多好事情，比如我们旅行了，见到了家人等等。这些事情一看到就会有感觉。我们会查看照片，选出大约10到20张，然后互相发信息讨论这些事情。
What's this look like though? Actually look like in the evening or you just hanging out over dinner? What's what are you guys doing? What if I'm like, Sam, I told you we're running a freaking business. We're in a conference room. What are you thinking? No. Okay. The truth is when we did this just recently, we were sitting across from each other, like basically on our couch, chilling. But most of the time we have these conversations, we're actually traveling. So we love to do this in a place that is different than our normal place. It's expansive. Usually we try to surround ourselves with beauty, but you know, that's not always possible. So the point, the setting helps, but it's just about the two of us having time and space.
这究竟是什么样的呢？晚上是怎样的情景，还是你们只是一起吃晚饭？你们都在做什么呢？如果我说，"Sam，我跟你说过我们在经营业务。我们在会议室里。"你会怎么想？其实真相是，我们最近这样做的时候，我们就坐在沙发上，彼此面对面，放松心情。但大多数时候，我们聊天时其实在旅行。所以我们喜欢在一个不同于平常的地方进行这种交流，那个地方让人心胸开阔。通常我们会尽量把自己置身于美丽的环境中，但这并不总是可行的。所以重点是，环境是一个辅助，但最重要的是我们两个能有时间和空间在一起。
So here I am looking at my photos and it becomes very obvious to me. The photos I chose like out of 20, 18 of them were with friends and family. Wow. Like that really tells me something about what's important to me. And so we start off there like, wow, what was memorable? We then talk about, we had this little exercise that we did this year. I came up with these questions, which was what if 2025 next year was incredibly generous? And we started there. And we're just like, what would we do if we were incredibly generous? And we just like came up with ideas back and forth. Next, adventurous. So it was like a wilderness course, you know? I don't even know how to start a fire. What if I went to a three day wilderness course? My wife was like, go on your own. I'm not trying to go to that. But that's cool too. You find out what you like, what you don't like. Next was luxurious. That was cool. Relaxed. And then social. So we're just dreaming. We're just like coming up with ideas and we're writing them down and that's it.
所以我在看自己的照片，突然意识到一件事：我从20张照片中挑了18张是和朋友和家人在一起的。这真让我明白什么对我来说是重要的。于是我们从这里开始，感叹：哇，什么是令人难忘的？接着讨论我们今年做的一个小活动。我想出了几个问题，比如如果2025年是一个非常慷慨的年份会怎样？我们从这个想法出发，畅想如果我们能做到非常慷慨的话会怎样，并不断地给出创意，互相讨论。接下来是冒险，让我想到“野外生存课程”，我甚至不知道如何生火。假如我去上一个为期三天的野外课程呢？我老婆说让我一个人去，她不想参加。这也挺好的，你会发现自己喜欢和不喜欢什么。然后是奢华、轻松和社交。所以我们就在做白日梦，提出各种想法并把它们写下来，就是这样。
Then we start getting into a little bit more specific stuff. What did we love this year? What do we want to do more of? These would be things like take a trip with friends, spend time with our parents, that kind of thing. And then we're like, what do we not like? What do we want to do less of? Oh, we tried to eat it. We got this reservation at this restaurant and it was a big deal. And we actually don't really care about that type of stuff. And then the last thing we do is we get into the numbers. You don't need to say your numbers, but tell me the title of the numbers. So for example, you look at your personal family's annual burn, your personal family's income. What else? We're talking at the expense level now. So we're talking line item. But these are the major categories in my conscious spending plan. So things like housing, travel for us is a big discretionary expense, all the mid-clothes, fitness. Those are the items we're talking about. And we're like, okay, we projected this, we hit this. Why did we diverge? And so then it's like, do we need to tweak it next year? Do we need to add more income? This is the type of stuff where we're talking about what are our distributions. I don't know if we can handle that next year, etc.
然后，我们开始进入一些更具体的内容。今年我们喜欢什么？我们想多做些什么？这些事情可能包括和朋友一起旅行，花时间陪伴父母之类的。而接着我们会想，我们不喜欢什么？我们想减少做些什么？比如，我们试着去一家餐馆吃饭，特别期待，但实际发现自己并不在乎这样的事情。
最后，我们进入数字部分。你不需要说出具体的数字，但可以告诉我数字的标题。比如，你查看个人家庭的年度支出，你的家庭收入等等。我们现在讨论的是开支层面的问题，逐项分析。但这些都是我有意识消费计划中的主要类别。比如住房，对我们来说旅行是一个很大的可自由支配的花费，还有服装、健身等。这些是我们讨论的项目。我们会说，好，我们预计是这样，结果达成了这个目标。为什么会有偏差？然后我们思考需要在明年做哪些调整？是否需要增加更多收入？这是我们在讨论的分配类型的问题。我们不知道是否能在明年应对等等。
And when you, this is like, I want to go deep on this. So you're setting the budget for the next year as well. And when you're doing the review, what percentage on track are you typically over? What is your family over under? That's a very good question. We're never exactly on. Never. We are definitely over in certain categories. Travel almost always over. So we adjust it every year. The dream is like you're going to nail it, but we never will. We leave buffer. We always leave buffer. You add 20%. Oh, yeah, I have like handy guidelines for buffers. So for example, for like a wedding, 2.5 X, like right there. Yeah. Okay. For a trip for travel, add 50% right off the bat. So if you think your trip is going to be 3,000, it's actually going to be 45.
当你设定下一年的预算时，同时也要进行审查。通常情况下，你的预算执行率是多少呢？你们家庭的预算通常是超出还是低于预期？这是个很好的问题。我们的预算从来没有完全准确。我们肯定在某些方面超支，旅行几乎总是超支，所以我们每年都会调整。理想情况下，我们当然希望能做到精准匹配，但实际上很难。因此，我们始终留有余地，通常会预留20%的预算空间。对于一些重要事情，比如婚礼，我们预留2.5倍的预算空间。对于旅行，从一开始就多加50%的预算。如果你预计旅行费用是3,000，那么实际上可能需要4,500。
God, it's not like unilaterally like, all right, we budgeted $100. Just assume that are in or whatever, $100,000 for the year for our whole life. Assume that it's going to be 120. We would do that for fixed costs. So fixed costs, which are like your rent, your auto, you know, your fixed things. Typically, I would say add 15% because there are things that people forget about. That's just a good guideline. By the way, that's why I do it my businesses. I like whatever we say the budget is in my head. I'm like 30% over. Okay. Let me tell you why. I think there are so many different ways with money. You can internalize lessons like fitness, luxury. I have this experience. We stayed in a hotel in Thailand. It's a high-end hotel.
上帝，不是说单方面就定下来了，好吧，我们预算了100美元。假设这些钱是包括在内的，或者说是全年整个生活的100,000美元。假设这个数目会变成120。我会把这套方法用在固定成本上。固定成本，比如你的租金、汽车费这些固定的东西。通常，我会建议增加15%，因为总有一些人会忘记的东西。这只是一个不错的指导原则。顺便说一句，这也是我在经营自己的生意时的做法。无论我们说预算是怎样的，我心里都会准备30%的溢出。好吧，让我告诉你为什么。我认为关于金钱有很多不同的理解方式，比如健身和奢侈。我曾有这样的经历：我们住在泰国的一家高端酒店。
Whenever I go to one of these hotels, I always ask to see the general manager and I go on a walk on the property with him, him or her. And I go, why are you laughing? It's weird. It's just that's a really caring thing to do, but you're doing it for a positive. Oh, what the hell are you talking about? I'm not saying like you're all the things that are wrong. I ask them, tell me how you run this hotel. Like what are the clientele? So for example. Do you then at the front desk or is your assistant or you send an email? I'll be checking in. Like dude, I want to get because let me explain. All right. Here's why.
每当我住这种酒店时，我总会要求见总经理，并和他或她一起在酒店里走走。我这样做没有其他意思，只是出于关心。我会跟他们说，请不要误会，我不是想指出这里有什么问题。我会问他们，你们是如何管理这家酒店的？比如说，客户群体是什么样的？然后，你会在前台询问，还是通过你的助理，或者通过邮件确认我的入住时间？让我解释一下，我这么做的原因是这样的。
Ramit said, hey, do you want to come to New York City and hang out with me? I'm going to plan for something to us to do. And I was like, hell yeah. And he was like, what do you want to do? And I was like, whatever you're interested in, because I know you're super into it, take me along. And so we went to the Amangiri or Amang New York. Is that what it's called? Aman, New York? Yeah. Like the Fancies Hotel in New York City and the general manager or some like a some manager type gave us this like one hour specialty tour of this like three or $4,000 night hotel. And I was like, dude, how do you who did you email to get this? So I like hotels. I like hospitality. And whenever I go to these hotels, the manager will when you're staying there, the manager will come up to you at a certain point and greet you. So I'm always like, hey, I'd love to like learn more about the property. Do you have any time? And they love it. They love it. So we went on a walk and it was December at the time. So I said, what's your occupancy? And they had something like 40 keys or 40 hotel rooms. He said, it's about to get busy. Christmas is our busiest of all, but we always keep one room off market. And I'm like, why would you do that when it's the busiest, most high demand, most expensive time of the year. He goes, luxury is about always having something in your back pocket. He goes, maybe our regular guests who come every year for the last decade bring an extra family member. We need to be able to accommodate that. So I will hold it off market. And I'm like, ah, that's a very expensive thing. But I think about my mom growing up, she always had extra food if we brought a friend over luxury, just at a different level. So same thing with money. I want to always build in a buffer so that if something happens, we're good. No sweat.
拉米特说：“嘿，你想来纽约和我一起玩吗？我会计划一些我们可以做的事情。”我回答：“当然想！”然后他问我想做什么，我说：“随你安排，只要是你感兴趣的事情，因为我知道你超级热衷这些，带我一起去吧。”于是我们去了纽约的Amangiri或者是Aman酒店，是这样叫的吗？Aman，纽约？嗯，像是纽约市最豪华的酒店之一。酒店的总经理或者类似的管理人员给我们进行了一小时的特别导览，这种房间一个晚上要三四千美元。我问他：“兄弟，你是给谁发邮件才弄到这个的？”我喜欢酒店，也喜欢酒店服务。每次住酒店时，酒店经理都会在某个时间点过来问候你。我总是说：“嘿，我很想多了解一下这个地方的情况，您有时间吗？”他们特别喜欢这个。所以我们一起散步，那时是12月，我问：“你们的入住率怎么样？”他们大约有40间客房。他说：“马上就要忙起来了，圣诞节是我们最忙的季节，但我们总是留一间房不对外开放。”我问：“为什么要这样做？这是全年最忙、需求最高、价格最贵的时间。”他说：“奢华的意义在于总有后备之策。比如我们的常客可能会额外带一个家庭成员，我们需要能够接待他们，所以我们会保留一个房间。”我心想：“这代价真高。”但想到我妈妈，当我小时候带朋友回家时，她总会多准备一些食物，这也是一种奢华，只是不同层次的表现。同样在金钱方面，我希望始终留有余地，这样如果发生什么事，我们也能轻松应对。
And how much, what percentage do you assume that every year your spending is going to go up like 5%, 10%? No, I probably should, but I don't do that. Now that would be good. We look at what we're going to do next year. And typically, certain things don't really change, for example, rent or whatever. It won't change that much. But if there are big life events, those might change. So we're not doing it on a percentage basis. We're looking at big, discreet events because we already have the foundation kind of laid out.
你认为每年你的开支会增长多少？像是5%还是10%？我并没有这样假设，也许我该这样做，但我目前并没有这样处理。我们通常会看看明年计划做些什么。一般来说，有些东西不会有太大变化，比如租金之类的。可是如果有重大的人生事件，那可能会改变很多。因此，我们不是按百分比来规划，而是关注一些重大具体事件，因为我们的基本规划已经有了一个大致的框架。
And then do you assume, and you guys are both entrepreneurs. And so let's do it for the question of like you and me, entrepreneurs, and also let's do this for like a Facebook employee. Do assume that your income is flat up or down? Great question. My wife and I are both entrepreneurs. So we take a standard salary, which we talk about at that annual Rich Life Review. What is our salary going to be? And it's typically the same salary. I didn't change my salary for like 13 years. But we talk about distributions. So are we playing, how does the business look next year? What numbers are we going for? What do we think our distributions will be?
然后，你们假设，并且你们两位都是企业家。我们可以这样看这个问题，比如你我都是企业家，也可以从像Facebook员工的角度来看。你认为你的收入是持平、增加还是减少呢？这是个好问题。我和我的妻子都是企业家，所以我们领取固定工资，这在我们每年的《富裕生活回顾》中讨论。我们的工资会是多少？通常我们的工资是一样的，我有13年没有改变过工资。但我们会讨论分红：我们在运筹什么，业务明年会如何？我们的目标是什么？我们认为我们的分红将是多少？
And we use distributions, which makes our system a little bit complex. We get them on a quarterly basis if we take them. And then we have a determination. We have a percentage like, where does it go? How does it get split up? All that stuff is all documented. We look at the document once a year in December and we decide, is this fair? Does this feel good? Do we need to tweak anything? But it's once a year. Yeah. And that's where it gets complicated because I do this with Sarah.
我们使用分配方式，这让我们的系统有点复杂。我们每季度分配一次（如果我们选择这样做）。之后我们会做一个决定，有一个比例来分配，比如：它流向哪里？如何分配？所有这些都有记录。我们每年十二月查看一次这些记录，决定这样分配是否公平、感觉是否合理、是否需要做任何调整。但这只是每年一次。对，就是这个过程有点复杂，因为我是和Sarah一起做的。
And I'm like, well, if business goes good, then it could be this. If something happens, you know, stuff happens. You know, like if you run an SEO based company, Google makes a change. And like my situation has just changed. I don't, I have to tell you, this is maybe a strength also a weakness. I don't want to have to go backwards. Right. So like it, that appeal to me, that's true in a lot of parts of life. For example, speaking of hotels, if I stayed at one hotel room one time, I'm not going to a lower level hotel room. I want to stay at the same level or go higher.
我的想法是，如果生意顺利发展，那一切都会很好。但事情难免会出意外，比如说你经营一家SEO公司，谷歌突然做了什么改变。我的情况也因此改变了。我得告诉你，这可能是我的优点也是缺点，我不想后退。所以这个观点吸引了我，这在生活的很多方面都是真实的。举个例子，谈到酒店时，如果我住过一次高档酒店，我就不愿意降级去住低档酒店。我希望能维持在同一水平，甚至追求更高的水平。
Why? Just because for me, that's a point of pride and something I value. For other people, it might be their car. You know, they finally got a, whatever is a nice car. And they don't want to go back to the Honda Civic that they grew up driving, whatever. I feel the same with money. If we decide we want something, I'm going to be very, very careful before I commit to spending on something that is probably something we don't want to go backwards on. Otherwise, I just wouldn't do it.
为什么呢？只是因为对我来说，这是一个值得骄傲的点，也是我重视的东西。对于其他人来说，可能是他们的车。你知道的，他们终于买了一辆好车，不想再回到他们小时候开过的本田思域。我对金钱也有同样的感觉。如果我们决定想要什么，我会非常非常谨慎地在花钱之前做决定，尤其是对于那些我们不想再退回去的东西。否则，我就不会这样做。
As an example, if somebody starts to, well, I know you've talked about flying private, you know, for a lot of entrepreneurs, it's like one of the things they want to do. Great. If that's a goal, I wouldn't do that until I knew I have no financial chance of ever going backwards. Because that's actually really hard for me. But that's rooted in your business, which means like my business is stable enough that it's likely going to continue to grow at some, even if it's a small 5 or 10%, but it's like a stable, recurring-ish revenue business, that type of thing. Or you have enough net worth to float it.
例如，有人可能会说，他们想要私人飞行。很多企业家都有这样的梦想，很好。但如果这是你的目标，我会建议等到确信自己在经济上永远不会倒退的时候再去做。因为对我来说，这实际上很困难。但这与您的业务息息相关，这意味着我的业务稳定到足以继续增长，即使增幅只有5%或10%，但具有稳定和可持续的收入。或者说，你的净资产足以支撑这个愿望。
But what I'm really encouraging people to do is you don't have to do this for everything. You know, like some years you have a splurge on some restaurant, maybe you're going to go back maybe not, whatever. But if it's really important to you, it might be we're sending kids to this school or we're going to decide that we're flying business class or whatever. Be very, very careful before you make a purchase that is recurring and you don't want to go back. Once you do it, make sure you're solid forever. How long does this annual meeting, annual review last, and what's the homework to prepare for it? It lasts several days. We're in no rush. So it's like we'll talk for a couple of hours and then we're off doing whatever we're doing, whether we're doing it on your calendar.
我真正想鼓励大家做的是，不必对所有事情都这样做。比如，有些年份你可能会在某家餐厅花费一大笔钱，看你是否想要再去，不去也没关系。但是如果某件事对你真的很重要，比如说让孩子上某个学校，或者决定坐商务舱，这时就要非常小心地做出决定，特别是那些会重复发生的购买，一旦做出选择，就要确保它能够长久。关于年度会议或年度审查通常持续几天，我们不急于求成。我们可能会聊上几个小时，然后各自去做自己的事情，无论是在你的日程表上安排的事。
Yeah. It's on the calendar, has a link to all of our docs, the one from last year, we review it. So some of it is structured, like we're talking about. We have these questions, what do I want to change, etc. And some of it though is really organic. And I think that is the part that might surprise people. So in my life, I'm an optimizer and so I love structure. I love it. And I think that has become a weakness of mine, where I always want the black or white answer and I need to make sure it fits in these cells.
好的。这是在日历上，上面有一个链接，包含了我们所有的文档，包括去年的。我们会进行审查。因此，其中一部分是有结构的，就像我们正在讨论的那样。我们有这些问题，比如“我想改变什么”等等。然而，其中的一部分是非常自然的。我认为这一部分可能会让人感到惊讶。在我的生活中，我是一个追求优化的人，所以我喜欢结构，我非常喜欢它。我觉得这已经成为了我的一个弱点，因为我总是想要一个明确的答案，并且希望一切都能符合这些框架。
And so I've been trying to become more intuitive and I find that I'm most intuitive when I'm traveling because I'm like, what do I feel like seeing? Where do I feel like going? What about us? And I'm trying to bring that to these meetings. So this question about generous and adventurous, that was an intuitive thing that I was thinking about and then we started talking about it and there was a lot of energy. So we spent like few hours talking about that. That is how I love to approach this, a combination of literal and also intuitive. What's the monthly meetings look like?
因此，我一直在努力变得更加直觉化，我发现当我旅行的时候，我是最有直觉的。因为我会想：“我想去看什么？我想去哪里？那我们呢？” 我试着把这种感觉带到会议中。这次关于“慷慨”和“冒险”的问题，就是我直觉上的一个想法，然后我们开始讨论，充满了活力。于是我们花了几个小时讨论这个话题。我喜欢以这种方式接近问题，结合实际和直觉。那么每个月的会议是什么样的呢？
Ours usually looks like we use Monarch. Do you know Monarch Money? That's just like a cool thing. In my opinion, that's my favorite tool for tracking monthly expenses. So we go over that and then we say like, all right, next month, what adventures or things do we have planned? And is there any like deviations or alterations that we want to make for that? We also talk about different goals that we have throughout the year. We want to take family on trips.
我们通常使用Monarch，它长得像这样。你知道Monarch Money吗？这是个挺酷的东西。在我看来，这是我最喜欢的每月开支追踪工具。所以我们会查看它并讨论，比如下个月有什么冒险或计划好的事情吗？我们是否想对这些计划进行任何偏离或更改？我们还会讨论全年设定的各种目标，比如我们想带家人去旅行。
And it's like, all right, like do we have that plan and what went well last time, what didn't go well, whatever. And then we talk about like, do you want to buy anything? Like is there anything you want to buy? I love that. Every time I hear you guys talk about how you do money, it makes me really happy because like there's a lot of connection and I hope that's inspiring to other folks because money for most is not a source of connection. It's a wedge. It's actually something that's avoided. Most couples really substantively talk about money about four times in their entire life.
好的，我们有这个计划吗？上次有什么地方做得好，有什么地方不太好，诸如此类的事情。然后我们会讨论，比如说你想买什么东西吗？我很喜欢这一点。每次听你们谈论如何处理金钱问题，我都感到很开心，因为这让你们之间更加联系紧密。我希望这能激励其他人，因为对大多数人来说，金钱并不是一种联系的来源，反而是个分歧点，甚至是被回避的东西。大多数夫妻在一生中实际上只有大约四次深入地讨论金钱问题。
What does that mean? So like, is there like a bunch of, I mean, I guess this is obvious. This is an obvious question, but I guess there's typically a bunch of wives out there who have no idea like what the income is and like, is that like typically what it is? 50% of couples who talk to me do not know their household income. Five zero. They don't know their household income.
这是什么意思呢？所以就是，有很多妻子根本不知道家庭收入是多少吗？我觉得这个问题很明显，但通常确实是这样吗？和我谈过的夫妻中，50%不知道他们的家庭收入是多少。五零。他们不知道家庭收入。
As an example, this happens all the time. I had a couple recently who said, I think we would feel good if we made 120,000 and I'm looking at their numbers, which they prepared for me. And according to their preparation, they make 80K. Okay. So now I'm digging into this and I'm asking about bonuses. They go, oh yeah, we get a bonus once in a while and I'm adding it all together. It turns out they make something like 121,000 and they just look completely dumbfounded. Why? Because for years, they've been telling themselves, we'll stop worrying when we make 120K. They've been making it for years.
例如，这种情况经常发生。我最近遇到一对夫妇，他们说：“如果我们的收入能达到12万，我们会感觉很好。”我查看了他们为我准备的财务数据，发现他们的收入是8万。于是，我深入调查并询问有关奖金的情况。他们说：“哦，对了，我们偶尔会拿到奖金。”我把所有收入加在一起，结果发现他们的年收入大约是12.1万。当他们听到这个结果时，他们完全惊呆了。为什么会这样？因为多年来，他们一直告诉自己：“等我们年收入达到12万时，就不用担忧了。”事实上，他们已经达到这个数字多年了。
And what it really shows is the way you feel about money is highly uncorrelated to the amount in your bank account. So no, they don't talk about money. Most see it as a negative thing. They see it as something to protect their partner from. They see it as something like you do the dishes all mow the lawn, but it's none of those. It's got to be a source of connection. Which is the thing you talk about, but by the way, you were giving me credit for these meetings. Like they still like occasionally end in fighting. Like it's like it doesn't, they don't always end well. Which is like, we are on the same page to discuss it, but we are not always on the same page of our wants.
这段话的意思是：你对金钱的感觉和你银行账户里的钱数其实没有太大关系。所以，他们并不讨论金钱。大多数人认为金钱是件负面的东西，是需要保护伴侣免受其影响的东西。他们把金钱看作像洗碗或剪草坪这样的事情，但其实并不是。金钱应该成为一种联系的来源，这是你们之间需要谈论的事情。不过你之前夸我讨论这些话题，其实有时这些对话还是会以争吵告终，并不是总能得到好的结果。我们可能在讨论这个话题时意见一致，但并不总是对彼此的需求意见一致。
Sometimes there's decisions where there's a winner and there's a loser and so it's like, how can we both win in one of these situations. But it definitely becomes like a who's the money person. And it's like not just like who's earning it, but who's driving. I guess it's frustrating to have, if I'm the one driving all the time, I'm like, I want you to care about this as much as I care about this. Sam, I'm with you. Okay, listen.
有时候在做决定时，会有一方胜利而另一方失败，所以我们会想，如何让双方都能在这样的情况下获胜。但最终往往变成了“谁是挣钱的人”的问题。这不仅仅是指谁在赚钱，还涉及到谁在推动事情的发展。如果总是我在推动，那我就会感到沮丧。我想要你像我一样在乎这件事情。Sam，我支持你。好了，听我说。
So in most relationships, there is one money person and this is a huge mistake. Again, most of us think of it as something that's just divided. Like every couple does. We all divide tasks just on time, intuition, etc. Or just habit. But money, when I got together with my wife, of course I was, it would have been natural for me to be the money person. This is what I do for a living. I think about it every day. And I very early on realized that would be a horrible mistake. And I told Cassandra, I said, we're going to do this together. I'll tell you why.
在大多数关系中，通常会有一个负责金钱的人，但这是一个很大的错误。我们大多数人通常认为这是理所当然的，就像每对情侣都会这样分工。我们都习惯根据时间、直觉等来分配任务，或者仅仅是出于习惯。不过，在金钱方面，当我和我妻子开始共同生活时，按理说我应该成为负责金钱的那个人，因为这是我的工作，我每天都在思考这个问题。但是我很早就意识到这样做会是一个巨大的错误。我对Cassandra说，我们要一起处理这件事，我会告诉你原因。
Number one, one day I'm going to get hit by a bus. Some shithead from Goldman Sachs Wealth Management is going to call her. Oh, we'd love to help you be a steward of your portfolio. Fuck you, wealth management industry. So she knows exactly about expense ratios and fees. Otherwise I'd be looking up from hell saying, what's about to happen right now with this conversation? But I know she's an amazing manager of money. Then I wanted us to have a second set of eyes. No matter how good you are at money, it's always better to have another person make decisions together. And third is just way more fun. Way more fun to be doing this together. Where you want to go next year? Who do you want to be generous with? All those things. So it's a huge mistake to be the money person in a relationship or let your partner. And that is becoming bigger and bigger because a lot of men die early leaving in heterosexual relationships. They leave their wife often defenseless. The wife doesn't even know where the money is much less. How much much less what to do with it? Bad, bad situation. So that is a big nodal.
第一，有一天我可能会被公交车撞到。然后就会有来自高盛财富管理的蠢货打电话给她，哦，我们很乐意帮助您管理您的投资组合。去你的，财富管理行业。所以我要确保她完全了解开支比率和费用。不然我会在地狱里仰起头来，心想，这对话现在要发生什么？不过我知道她是个了不起的理财高手。我也希望我们有第二双眼睛。不管你在理财方面多么厉害，一起做决定总是更好的。而且这样更有趣。一起计划明年要去哪，想对谁慷慨赠予，这些都让生活更有趣。所以，成为关系中的理财角色或者把这职责交给伴侣都是大错特错。这个问题越来越严重，因为很多男性早逝，在异性婚姻关系中，他们常常让妻子手足无措。妻子甚至不知道钱在哪里，更别提有多少以及该如何处理，这种情况非常糟糕。所以这是一个巨大的警醒。
Dude, I was telling Sarah the other day. Ever since we had a kid, I had this weird dream. It sounds weird to even say it. But I had this dream that she dies and like three weeks after her death. I'm like, I don't even, so the way my household works is I focus on making the money. And she is in charge of tracking and spending it. So like paying rent or mortgages and things like that. And when she died in my dream, I'm like, who do I pay this rent to? Or do you know what I mean? I was like, I literally don't know what health insurance provider we have and how they get their money versus how like, who's our dentist? You know what I mean? I didn't even know certain things like that. And it honestly freaked me out. And I couldn't imagine being on the other side of that of like, how do we earn? Exactly. I mean, it's kind of funny when you say it, but it's not funny if you're the person who doesn't know where the money comes from or how are things supposed to be paid. And it's actually terrifying and very, very bad situation to be.
哥们儿，前几天我跟莎拉聊过这个问题。自从我们有了孩子，我一直有个奇怪的梦。说出来都感觉怪怪的。在梦里，她去世了，大概过了三个星期。我不知道怎么回事儿，反正我们家是这样运转的：我主要负责赚钱，她负责管理和花钱，比如支付房租或按揭这些东西。梦里她去世后，我都不知道该把房租付给谁，或者说，你懂我的意思吗？我甚至不知道我们的健康保险公司是哪家，该怎么付钱，还有我们的牙医是谁这些问题。我对这些事情一点都不了解，真的让我感到害怕。我也无法想象如果她站在我的位置会是什么样子，比如该怎么赚钱。虽然说起来有点搞笑，但是如果是那个不知道钱从哪里来的人或者不知道怎么付款的人，这种情况真的很吓人，也很糟糕。
So all right, let me talk about the monthly money meeting and how to do it. It's quick. It's 60 minutes. So you're kind of moving through these things. I have six quick, seven quick steps. It's very easy. All right. First off, appreciation. Kind of unexpected. Always start off with something you appreciate about your partner. Look at Sam's face right now. Sam's goal. What the fuck is this? Whoa, weirdo talking about move to Ellen. No. First, maybe about appreciation. Where's the crystal? I laugh because we do that. What? And it's definitely still uncomfortable. Oh, yeah. Okay. Fine. Damn. Impress. Like, I think you told me about it. Like, I've been doing it. We've been doing these for years, but I'll like you or someone else like share something and I'm like, I'm going to add that. Yeah. I'm thankful. I'm so, I appreciate that whenever we travel as a family, you always make sure we get to the airport at the right time. Simple. I mean, you cannot say enough nice things. All right. So that's number one. Number two is partner one updates. Quick things. Usually each partner will own one part of the financial system. It could be they own how much you spent on groceries last month or it could be making sure that this account flows to that and changing things. Just a quick update. If something has not gone right, like, hey, we agreed that we're going to spend 700 on groceries. Last month, I actually wasn't able to hit that. It was 850. Here's what I'm doing about it next month, right? They own it. They get ahead of it. They talk about what they're doing as a plan. Take a shine a light on it. Don't let it fester. Partner two does the same thing.
好的，让我来谈谈每月的财务会议以及如何进行。这是个简单快速的过程，只需要60分钟，所以你要快速完成这些步骤。我这儿有六七个简单的步骤，真的很简单。首先，欣赏对方。有点出乎意料吧？每次都从你欣赏伴侣的某件事情开始。想象一下Sam的表情。Sam的反应可能是：「这是什么鬼？哇，这家伙在说什么奇怪的事情？」其实一开始可以从表达感激开始。我笑了，因为我们确实这样做了，虽然还是会觉得有点不自在。好吧，第二步是伴侣一的更新。简单快速的更新，通常每个伴侣会负责一个财务系统的一部分。比如负责记录上个月买菜花了多少钱，或者确保这个账户正确转账到另一个账户。如果事情没有按照计划进行，比如「我们同意每个月在买菜上花700，但上个月没能做到，花了850。下个月我会采取措施来解决这个问题。」伴侣要负责追踪问题，提前解决，分享他们的计划，不要让问题恶化。伴侣二同样进行更新。
Then you're doing joint updates. So are there any things we need to talk about together? Hey, what's up with your 401k? Are you having the correct match? That kind of thing. Five, review our numbers. So like, are there any critical numbers? I actually don't look at many numbers on a monthly basis because we plan it on an annual basis and we look at it on a six-month quick check-in because that gives us time to adapt if we need to. But I'm not trying to look at the freaking price of noodles in February. I don't want to talk about that.
翻译如下：
然后，你们要进行联合更新。那么，有什么事情是我们需要一起讨论的吗？嘿，你的401k怎么样？你有正确的匹配吗？诸如此类的。第五，审核我们的数据。比如说，有哪些关键数据？我其实每个月不怎么看数据，因为我们是按年度计划的，并且每隔六个月进行一次快速检查，这样如果需要的话，就有时间做出调整。但我不想去关心二月份面条的价格。我不想讨论这个。
Six, open issues, anything open, and then seven, wrap it up. Always end with, I love you. I appreciate you. Give each other a hug. Start to align money with feeling good. And it might feel cheesy at first. You do it four or five, 10 times. You're going to actually start to feel it. You tweeted out this thing or I think it was from the book that you shared, but it had percentages for it had like, like benchmark numbers of like, save this percent, invest this percent, spend this amount on guilt-free things. Can you do those same percentages but for a couple that earns 300 or let's, we're actually going to round up for math, $500,000 a year. Okay. I'll give you the standard numbers first quickly and then let's talk about how things change if you earn more.
六，开放议题，看看有没有什么未解决的问题，然后七，总结一下。结束时，总是说“我爱你”、“我感激你”，互相拥抱一下。开始让金钱与愉悦感相结合。起初可能觉得有点矫情，但是做四五次，甚至十次后，你真的会开始感觉到它。你发过一个推文，或者我记得你分享过书中的内容，上面有一些百分比，比如储蓄多少、投资多少、无负担消费多少。你能否用这些百分比来对应一个年收入30万（为了便于计算，我们凑整为50万美元）的家庭？好的，我先快速给你标准的数字，然后再聊聊如果你赚得更多，情况会有什么变化。
So there are four key numbers you need to know in your financial infrastructure. I love it. Just four. You don't need to track the price of pickles. The first is fixed costs. That's rent, mortgage, groceries, debt, auto. That's 50 to 60 percent of take home pay. Next up is investing. That's five to 10 percent of take home pay. Of course, that's where real wealth is created. So I would prefer the higher the better. Next is saving. This is an emergency fund saving for a down payment. Even saving for a kid's activity or a vacation, five to 10 percent. And finally, my favorite one of all guilt-free spending. This is eating out, travel, buying around a drink, whatever, 20 to 35 percent. So for me, the beautiful part is if you can fit it in like Tetris, fantastic. You can buy whatever you want as long as you're hitting these key numbers. It's very freeing.
在你的财务规划中，有四个关键数字你需要了解。我非常喜欢这一点，因为只需要四个。不用追踪泡菜的价格。首先是固定成本，包括房租、抵押贷款、食品、债务和汽车费用，这些占税后收入的50%到60%。接下来是投资，占税后收入的5%到10%。投资是创造真正财富的所在，所以我希望这个比例越高越好。然后是储蓄，包括紧急备用基金、首付款储蓄，甚至是为了孩子的活动或旅行存钱，占5%到10%。最后，我最喜欢的是无愧于心的花销，包括外出就餐、旅行和买饮料等，占20%到35%。对我来说，如果你能像玩俄罗斯方块一样把这些项目安排好，那就太棒了。只要满足这些关键数字，你可以买任何你想要的东西，非常令人自在。
Now, when I look at couples or individuals who make a lot of money, 500k is an example. There's a couple of things that are common. The first is their fixed cost number tends to go lower because their income is higher. So instead of 60 percent, or in some cases people have 60, 70, 80 percent, their number is like 50 percent. It's on the lower end of that range. Once in a while, depending on where they live, it can even be lower than that. Their investing is typically higher. People who are making that kind of money, typically not always, but typically tend to be a little savvier with investing. And because the price of bread is basically the same, like, yeah, you might spend double the price on bread, but you're not going to spend 50 times more on bread. Therefore, you have more money left over. Typically, that goes into investing. Some of them save aggressively. For investing, they might have 15 percent of take-home pay. If they're in the fire community or they're very aggressive, they might go 20, 25 percent of net pay. I like to see that number around 20 percent as your income gets up because when you have that kind of money, take it, make it work for you. The earlier you can do that, you can really let it ride and grow.
现在，当我看到年收入较高的个人或夫妻，比如收入50万的，就会发现一些共同点。首先，他们的固定成本比例往往较低，因为收入较高。所以他们的固定成本占收入的比例不是60%，或者有时候很多人是60%、70%、80%，而是50%左右，处于这个范围的较低端。有时候，根据他们住在哪里，这个比例甚至还会更低。这样的收入者通常在投资上会更为积极。他们通常对投资较为精明，因为面包的价格基本是不变的，比如，你可能花双倍价格买面包，但不可能花50倍价钱。这样就有更多的钱可以用来投资。部分人会积极储蓄，在投资上可能会拿出税后收入的15%。如果他们属于"Fire"（财务独立，提前退休）社区，或者非常激进的话，可能是20%到25%的税后收入。我建议当收入提高时，把约20%的收入用于投资，因为有了这么多钱，就应该让它为你工作。越早开始这样做，资金就能增长得越快。
Savings, 5 to 10 percent, sometimes they go a little bit higher. You know what I often find with guilt-free spending, they can certainly be spending at the higher end of that. 35 percent of 500k is a lot of money, or 35 percent of the take-home. Oh, these are all post-tax. Correct. Post-tax. Sometimes, I will see people who are investing like crazy. They're doing 40 percent or 30 percent of take-home pay. And I'm like, there's a lot of money. Your savings is really high. And then I get down to the bottom of the conscious spending plan, and they're spending like 8 percent on guilt-free spending. And I'm like, what do you guys do for fun? And they're like, they always say the same thing. Well, you know, we like to go, we go to the park, we actually have money set aside. And then I go like this, do you actually spend it? And then they both look down because they wait till the end of the year, they don't spend their money, and then you know what they do with the money that's left over from guilt-free spending? They sweep it right into their investing. And they go, we're so good, we don't spend money, we invest it. That's a big mistake. You need to learn the skill of earning money. You need to learn the skill of managing money, but you also need to learn the skill of spending money meaningfully.
储蓄通常占收入的5%到10%，有时会更高。在无压力消费方面，我发现人们往往倾向于在这个区间的高端消费。对有些人来说，35%的年收入达50万是很大一笔钱，或者将35%的可支配收入花掉。这些都是税后的收入。确实，有时我会看到一些人疯狂投资，把30%或40%的可支配收入用于投资。我会想，这真是一大笔钱啊，你们的储蓄比例很高。然后我看看他们的有意识消费计划，发现他们在无压力消费上只花了8%。我会问他们，你们平时怎么样娱乐呢？他们总是说同样的话，我们喜欢去公园，其实也有存一些钱。我就会问，那你们真的花这些钱了吗？他们通常会不好意思地低下头，因为他们总是等到年底才花掉这些钱，剩下的无压力消费的钱就直接投入到投资里。他们会觉得自己很棒，因为不乱花钱，而是用来投资。这是一个重大错误。你需要学习赚钱的技能，学习管理钱财的能力，同时还需学习如何有意义地花钱。
So if you're making 500k, you should be learning how to spend that on the things that are meaningful to you. How do you get someone who's a warrior to start spending? It's very difficult. Let me tell you why it's so hard. I have frequently have multi-millionaires who come on my show, and you know, sometimes one or both films, like we want to learn how to spend more. And people listening are like, what kind of freaks don't know how to spend money? That doesn't make any sense. I'm one of them. Yes, it's a very common affliction. And it is an affliction because there are a lot of reasons for it. Often people grew up financially insecure, family only said we can't afford it.
所以，如果你的收入是50万美元，你应该学会如何把这些钱花在对你有意义的事情上。怎样才能让一个精打细算的人开始花钱呢？这非常困难。让我告诉你为什么这么难。我经常有几百万富翁来我的节目，有时其中一个或两个人会说我们想学着花更多钱。听众就会想，怎么会有人不知道怎么花钱？这听起来很奇怪。我就是其中之一。是的，这是一种很常见的问题。之所以说是问题，是因为有很多原因。通常，人们小时候在经济上并不宽裕，家庭常说我们买不起。
The only way they've related to money is scarcity. But when the numbers change, they change faster than the psychology changes. The problem is that you can get to a point where you have more than enough, but you're unable to actually spend. And I see several things happening. One, I see people who realize at a certain point, like this isn't something's wrong. We have these numbers on a spreadsheet, but it doesn't feel real. I went through this where it was like as an entrepreneur, who's so my business, I sold it and made, I had a windfall leading up to that. It was like, I think I ran the company for four years, but something like the first three years, for the first two years, I paid myself roughly $24,000 a year, which was so stupid. People should not do that because my business was doing fine.
他们与金钱的关系一直是基于匮乏感。但是，当数字发生变化时，数字变化的速度往往比心理变化的速度要快。问题是，你可能到了一个已经足够富裕的地步，但却无法真正去花这些钱。我看到了一些现象发生。首先，我看到有些人意识到某个时刻觉得事情不对劲。我们在电子表格上的这些数字只是一串数字，并不真实。我自己也经历过类似的情况，当时作为一个企业家，我卖掉了自己的公司，并因此获得了一大笔财富。在成立公司的前四年里，其中的前两年我每年只给自己支付大约24000美元的工资，这实在太傻了。人们不应该这么做，因为我的公司其实运转得很好。
I could have paid myself more. And so the third year was more, but it was like $100,000 a year, which in San Francisco is not like crazy amounts of money. So there was like a long period of like, not a lot, not a lot, not a lot, a lot, and that it took like another three years to acclimate to the reality. I love that reality. It's pretty unusual. Most people don't get the windfall like you did, but it may as well be the same thing because they look at the numbers and they're still feeling the way they felt when they were seven years old, sitting around the dining table and their mom or dad said, how dare you ask for that?
我本来可以给自己多发点薪水。所以在第三年，收入多了一些，大约是每年10万美元，但在旧金山这并不是个很高的金额。所以，经历了很长一段时间的收入少少少少，突然多了很多，然后我用了大约三年时间才适应这种变化。我很喜欢这种状态，这种情况很不常见。大多数人不会像你那样得到这种意外之财，但可能会有类似的感受，因为他们看到数字后，依然会感受到小时候坐在餐桌旁，父母对他们说“你怎么敢提出这种要求”时的感觉。
We can't afford that. And so I know you've been on a journey to spend more money. It's awesome to see you talking about men's wear now, talking about taking your family traveling. Like that's not easy. That is really not easy. What I find is the ultimate thing that happens with folks is they start to ask for help and they look around and they make two mistakes. One is they ask for help among a bunch of other frugal people. So I see this in the fire community every day. Hey everybody, I realize I've crossed my fire number, but I can't seem to know like, I can't seem to bring myself to spend money.
我们承担不起这些费用。所以，我知道你一直在尝试多花一些钱。看到你现在开始谈论男装，还计划带家人去旅行，真是太棒了。这样的事情并不容易，确实不容易。我发现，很多人最终都会去寻求帮助，但往往会犯两个错误。一个是他们向一群节俭的人寻求帮助。我每天都在FIRE社区（财务独立提早退休）看到这样的情况：有人说，“大家好，我发现自己已经达到了FIRE的目标，但就是不知道怎么去花钱。”
And then within three comments people like, you don't actually need to spend money. It's actually better to save. You should save it because who knows what health care is going to cost in 2065. I like you're asking a bunch of frugalistas how to spend money. You're asking the wrong community. Well, it's like asking me how to go camping. Don't ask me. I have no idea. Okay, that's the first. Second is they come around and they start to actually try something. Maybe they eat out at a restaurant, whatever. And the first time they do it, it's not particularly great. Maybe they picked a bad restaurant. Maybe they don't have the palate for it. Maybe they hired somebody to come clean their apartment or house and they don't like how the person folds their clothes.
在三条评论内，人们就会说，其实你不需要花钱。这实际上更好的是存钱。你应该存钱，因为谁知道2065年的医疗费用会是多少。我觉得你在问一群节俭达人怎么花钱，你真是问错社区了。就像你问我怎么去露营，不要问我，我完全不知道。好，这是第一点。其次，他们开始尝试一些事情，比如去餐馆吃饭等等。他们第一次尝试的时候可能不太好，也许是选错了餐馆，或者他们不太懂得品尝，又或者他们请人来打扫公寓或房子，但不喜欢那个人叠衣服的方式。
Okay, that happens. So then they go, this shit doesn't work. I actually, I'm a good person because I don't spend money. I don't need to do all this frivolous stuff that other people do. So they created this self-contained tautology, which ensures that they're never going to change. There's a much better way to do it. It's to build the skills now. It's to start spending on little things, discover what you like, what you don't, become clear with your money dials, enjoy it, do with a partner. And over time, you learn that spending money as a skill is often as important as earning and managing it too.
好的，这种情况有时会发生。于是他们就说，这玩意不管用。实际上，我是个好人，因为我不乱花钱。我不需要去做那些其他人做的无聊事情。这样，他们就形成了一个封闭的自我证明体系，确保自己永远不会改变。但其实有更好的方式，那就是现在就开始培养技能。从小花销开始，去发现你喜欢什么、不喜欢什么，明确你的消费重点，享受它，也可以和伴侣一起这样做。随着时间的推移，你会发现，会花钱这种技能往往和赚钱和管理钱同样重要。
And I think that like the important thing is figuring out what makes you happy because there's been times where I'll talk to you or me to you and we force what makes us joyful onto the other person. Like for example, you like fancy hotels and you're like, you should go stay at this hotel. It's like, that's just not- You saw your thing. I'm not, I'm kind of, this is a fake story a little bit because you don't do this too much or maybe even ever, but it's like, go stay at this fancy hotel. You're going to love it. It's like, that's not my, I don't get joy out of that. But what I love is like services, monthly services, so for you, for example, you don't own a house because you're like, I just don't get joy from that.
我觉得重要的是要搞清楚什么能让你快乐，因为有时候我会和你交流，或者你和我交流，我们会把让自己快乐的东西强加给对方。比如，你喜欢豪华酒店，你会说，“你应该去住这家酒店。”就像这样——虽然这是个虚构的例子，也许你并不会这样做，但你明白，如果有人对我说“去住在这家豪华酒店，你会爱上的”，我可能会觉得这并不是我想要的快乐。我更喜欢的东西，比如每月的服务订阅。而对于你来说，比如你不拥有房子，因为那并不能给你带来快乐。
And I don't know what your apartment looks like there, but like for all I know it could be just like a very, very modest apartment because you get joy spending elsewhere. And I think that that's like a really, that's a really challenging thing for people to get over because for example, they'll say, like here's a really easy one. They'll say like, buy a home, it's a great investment. And I'll say, well, it's typically not a great investment or like that's not the reason to buy it. And they'll be like, well, you're going to throw away money on rent and I'm like, well, you're not throwing money away. I'm acquiring a service and it makes me happy. And I'm also like buying, I'm like, my money is now in a, in the index fund that's growing. So like that's a good investment. And they'll be like, so you shouldn't buy a home? And it's like, well, no, no, definitely buy a house. Just like I bought a steak last night.
我不知道你在那边的公寓是什么样子的，但在我看来，可能只是一个非常非常普通的公寓，因为你喜欢把钱花在别的地方。我觉得这对很多人来说是个很难克服的问题。比如，他们会说，买房子吧，这是一项很好的投资。我会说，其实通常房子并不是一个很好的投资，或者说这不是买房子的理由。他们可能会说，你租房就是在浪费钱，我会说，其实并不是浪费钱，我租房是获得一种服务，这让我开心。而且我的钱也投在了成长中的指数基金，这是个不错的投资。然后他们可能会问，那你就不应该买房吗？其实，我的意思并不是不要买房，就好像我昨晚还买了一块牛排一样。
I bought this steak last night because it brought me joy. And if like owning your home makes you happy, and by the way, it oftentimes could be a good store of value, but like, which is a, which is just a cherry on top, but do it because you work and this makes you happy. And that's a good reason to do it. It's hard for people to understand just doing something because it brings you joy. And I've been there too. Yes, I love what you're saying. And I love watching you on Twitter because you're one of the only people who actually understands buying a primary residence is, sometimes, but often not a great investment. Here's what I think. I think that people use the word investing way too much. Like I have a personal trainer. That's not an investment.
我昨晚买了这块牛排，因为它让我感到快乐。如果拥有一个房子让你快乐，顺便说一下，这通常可能是一个很好的价值储存，但这只是锦上添花。之所以这样做，是因为你工作并且这让你快乐。这是一个很好的理由。人们常常难以理解仅仅因为某件事让你快乐就去做它。我也有过这样的经历。是的，我喜欢你所说的话。我也喜欢在Twitter上看你，因为你是为数不多真正理解购买住宅有时并不是一个好的投资的人之一。这里是我的看法：我认为人们太过频繁地使用“投资”这个词。比如我有一个私人教练，这不是一种投资。
That's a luxury. If I, if I were to buy a house today, that would not be an investment. That would be the most expensive luxury I have ever bought. I will lose millions one day when I buy a house. I guarantee it. I'm going to lose, and I'm going to do it with a big smile. And you're going to be ridiculed on the internet because people know you as the guy who has, they say, but, Rameet, you said never buy a home. Well, illiterate people who don't actually read what I've said. I never said don't buy a house. I said, run the numbers, then consider the non-financial. And then, but yes, you're right. There's going to be a big problem when I buy a house. Anyway, we use the word investing a lot to justify purchases. Like I've had people who literally said buying a mattress, a $2,000 mattress, is an investment. That's not an investment. That's a luxury.
这是一种奢侈。如果我今天买一套房子，那不会是一项投资。那将是我买过的最昂贵的奢侈品。将来有一天买房时，我会亏上百万。我保证我会亏损，但我会带着大大的微笑去做这件事。你会在网上被嘲笑，因为人们知道你是那个常说“从来不买房子”的人。但实际上，那些没读过我说什么的人才会这么认为。我从没说过不要买房。我说过，先计算数字，再考虑非金融因素。但没错，当我买房的时候，确实会有个大问题。无论如何，我们常用“投资”这个词来合理化一些消费。比如，我见过一些人说，买一个价值2000美元的床垫是一种投资。但那不是投资，那是一种奢侈。
So when I asked them, this got me very obsessed. How do you know if you can afford it? And do you know what people said to me? They were like, your back is the most important investment you can make. I was like, hey, when I ask a question about affordability, your answer better have a number at it. Affordability is a number, not a feeling. And what I've realized is so many of us use investment to justify purchases. But what's the Reme approved answer to that? My answer for an investment, I narrowly define it as something that can provide a financial return. Simple. Otherwise, here I am justifying a $3,000 in a hotel. Oh, their air conditioning is triple-filter.
所以当我问他们这个问题时，我变得非常执着。你怎么知道你能负担得起呢？你知道他们怎么回答我的吗？他们说，你的背部是你可以进行的最重要的投资。我就想，嘿，当我问关于负担能力的问题时，你的回答最好是一个数字。负担能力是一个数字，而不是一种感觉。我意识到，很多人用“投资”来为购买辩解。但是，Reme认可的答案是什么呢？我对投资的定义很简单，它应该是能够提供财务回报的东西。否则，我就在为一个3000美元的酒店找理由，因为他们的空调是三层过滤的。
Therefore, the hair on my arm doesn't stand up. Therefore, I can write a new book that makes me $100,000. It's BS. Same for the face cream I use. It's not an investment. It's okay to say, I like this and I'm going to buy it because I like it. That's totally fine. Now, the affordability question becomes more complicated. You have to know your numbers and you have to have your percentages dialed in. But affordability is a financial question. It is not about feelings.
因此，我手臂上的汗毛没有竖起来。所以，我也能写一本让我赚10万美元的新书。这纯属胡扯。同样的道理也适用于我用的面霜。这不是一种投资。可以坦率地说，我喜欢这个，所以我要买，因为我喜欢它。这完全没问题。现在，关于能否负担得起的问题就变得复杂了。你需要了解自己的财务状况，清楚分配比例。但能否负担得起是个财务问题，而不是情感问题。
And for the optimizer's listing, I will say sometimes when you're talking to a partner who's not an optimizer, they want to talk about feelings. And in the book, I emphasize how important feelings are. You've got to meet your partner where they are. You can't just talk about numbers alone, but sometimes you need to actually engage with the numbers. Feelings are good. You should spend a lot of time on them. But at a certain point, you're running a business, the business of the household, and you need to look at the numbers.
在优化者的观点中，有时候你会发现，当和一个不是优化者的伴侣交流时，他们可能更倾向于谈论感受。在书中，我强调了感受的重要性。你应该以他们的角度去理解和沟通，不能只谈论数字。但有时候，你也需要认真考虑数字。感受是好的，你应该花很多时间在这上面。但在某种程度上，你也在经营一个家庭事务的“生意”，因此你需要关注数字。
So I'm obsessed with being transparent about money, particularly with ultra high net worth people. The reason being is that there's not a lot of information on this demographic. And so because I own Hampton, which is a community for founders, I have access to thousands of young and incredibly high net worth people. We have people worth hundreds of millions and sometimes billions of dollars inside of Hampton. And so every year we do this thing called a Hampton wealth report where we survey over a thousand entrepreneurs and we ask them all types of information about their personal finances.
我对关于金钱的透明度非常着迷，特别是对超高净值人群。这是因为关于这个群体的信息很少。而由于我拥有哈普顿（Hampton），一个为创始人创建的社区，我能够接触到成千上万的年轻且净资产极高的人。在哈普顿，我们有的人身价数亿甚至数十亿美元。因此，每年我们都会进行一项名为“哈普顿财富报告”的活动，我们会调查一千多位企业家，询问他们各种关于个人财务的信息。
We ask them about how they're investing their money, what their portfolio looks like. We ask them about their monthly spend habits. We ask them how they've set up their estate, how much money they're going to leave to charity, how much money they keep in cash, how much money they're paying themselves from their businesses. Basically, every question that you want to ask a rich person, we went and we do it for you and we do it with hundreds and hundreds of people. So if you want to check out the report, it's called the Hampton wealth report. Just go to joinhampton.com, click our menu and you're going to see a section called reports and you're going to see it all right there. It's very easy.
我们询问他们是如何投资资金的，他们的投资组合是什么样子的。我们还问他们每月的消费习惯、如何规划财产、准备留给慈善机构多少钱、手头保留多少现金，以及从他们的企业中为自己支付多少薪水。基本上，所有你想问富人的问题，我们都帮你问了，而且采访了成百上千的人。如果你想查看这份报告，它叫做《Hampton 财富报告》。只需访问 joinhampton.com，点击菜单，你会看到一个名为 "报告" 的部分，里面就有所有你想要的信息。非常简单。
So again, it's called the Hampton wealth report. Go to joinhampton.com, click the menu and then click the report button. And let me know what you think. How do you get over disagreements? Like if you or your wife is complaining to each other? The most common reason for these disagreements is there is no shared vision of a rich life. It's literally one episode after another of nitpicking. And the perfect example I have is a person who wrote me on Instagram DM and said, can you convince my husband to stop buying iced tea every day? I said, okay, how much is it cost?
再说一次，它被称为汉普顿财富报告。请访问joinhampton.com，点击菜单，然后点击报告按钮。告诉我你的想法。你们是如何处理分歧的？比如你或者你的妻子互相抱怨的时候？这些分歧最常见的原因是缺乏对美好生活的共同愿景。简直就是一连串的吹毛求疵。我有一个完美的例子：一个人在Instagram私信中写信问我，能不能说服她丈夫不要每天买冰茶。我问，好吧，那这个花多少钱？
She goes, it's $5 every single day, we can make it a whole. I said, okay, interesting. Hey, out of curiosity, what's your household income? And she became very cagey, but I gently asked her to share it. She lives in New York. She and her husband. You want to guess what they make? I don't know what $200,000 a year. $600,000 a year. So what you could see is that it's really not about the $5 to him. It was like, hey, we work hard. This is just a little treat that I enjoy every day. It's great. To her, it was values based on how she was raised and why would you spend money outside?
她说，每天花5美元，我们可以把它攒起来。我觉得有趣，就问她，你们家每年的收入是多少？她显得有些不愿意透露，但我还是温和地请她分享。她和她丈夫住在纽约。你猜他们年收入是多少？我猜可能是20万美元？不，是60万美元。由此可见，对他来说，这真的不是关于那5美元的问题。他觉得，嘿，我们辛苦工作，这只是我每天的小小享受，很不错。而对她来说，这是与她成长经历有关的价值观，为什么要在外面花钱呢？
A couple of thoughts when couples have disagreements, whatever the scale. The first is, I always ask him, what is your rich life? Couples don't know. They never talked about it. They've only talked about why did you spend that much on a drink? So what do we want in our life? What's important to us? Do we want to travel? Do we want to send our kids to this activity? Get into all that, which I go into detail on. The next is to have your accounts set up so that you don't have to have $3 conversations. Stan, you said that the audience we're talking about today makes $200 or so plus K per year.
当夫妻有分歧时，不论大小，有几个想法值得分享。首先，我总是问他，你想要的富足生活是什么样的？很多夫妻并不清楚，因为他们从未真正讨论过这个问题。他们只是在谈论为什么你要花那么多钱买一杯饮料。所以我们到底想要过怎样的生活？什么对我们才是重要的？我们想去旅行吗？我们想让孩子参加这个活动吗？深入探讨这些问题，我对此更为详细地讨论过。接下来就是设置好你的账户，这样你就不用再为花三美元的事情争吵。斯坦，你之前说我们今天讨论的听众年收入在20万美元或以上。
You should not be talking about $3 purchases if you're making $200,000 a year. If you are talking about $3 purchases, you have misaligned your money systems and you probably don't have a rich life. So the way that you set up your accounts to be united in a marriage, I highly recommend all the money goes into a joint account and from there, you each have some of the money flow to a separate individual account, a no questions asked account, which both of you know about, but each of you only has access to your own.
如果你年收入达到20万美元，就不应该在意3美元的支出。如果你还在讨论这种小额支出，那就说明你的理财方式可能不太合理，也可能没有过上富裕的生活。因此，在婚姻中设置账户的方式，我强烈建议将所有的钱放入一个共同账户中，然后从那里分别划拨一部分资金到各自的个人账户，这是一种无需问对方理由的账户，双方都知道存在，但各自只对自己的账户有使用权。
And if that person wants to buy the $5 lemonade or the $20 tip, it's totally up to that. That's their money, no questions asked. That is how you unify your financial relationship and also give each other a little bit of flexibility. Yeah, I did this year. I have like my own little, my own account. How did it change things? You know, I think that even though you called me an optimizer, I'm a little, I'm more of a warrior and I definitely feel guilt. Oftentimes buying things if they're above a certain amount, maybe in the thousands of dollars range.
如果那个人想买5美元的柠檬水或者给20美元的小费，那完全取决于他们。这是他们的钱，无需多问。这就是如何统一你们的财务关系，同时也给彼此一些灵活性。是的，我今年这样做了。我有了自己的小账户。这带来了什么变化呢？你知道吗，即使你把我称作优化高手，其实我更像是一个勇士，我绝对会感到内疚。通常当购买的东西价格在某个范围以上时，比如几千美元，我会犹豫。
And so I put 20 grand into an account because I was like here, I'm newly into, somewhat newly into clothing and I got interested in like the craftsmanship and a lot of like this Japanese shit that I love. It's like pretty expensive. Like it's like $600 for like a button up shirt, but like I'm just like deeply fascinated by what I'm reading and I just want to like feel and touch it and it's interesting to me. But I would feel a sense of guilt around it. So I was like, look, I've allocated $20,000. I could spend this guilt free. And so I will spend it. I still feel guilt, but it's definitely less guilt. But now at least I know that like I used to feel a little sense of I'm disappointing Sarah because even though she's like, I'm bored with it, I'm like, I'm taking money away from from the shit that she could use for something else. And I was like, and I'm also like, I'm embarrassed to spend $600 on like a shirt and I don't want her to know. It came from all these just being raised poor shit that like, you know, it never goes away. You just like, it's just like any other like daddy issues anyone ever ever has. It never goes away. You just try to manage it.
于是，我把两万美元存入一个账户，因为我对服装有了新的兴趣，尤其是日本的一些服装工艺让我着迷。这些衣服很贵，比如一件衬衫就要600美元，但我对自己读到的东西非常感兴趣，总想亲手感受一下。不过，我会因花这么多钱而感到内疚。所以我告诉自己，既然我已经拨出两万美元，那就可以无罪恶感地消费这笔钱。尽管内疚感仍然存在，但确实少了很多。至少我知道，以前我总觉得自己让莎拉失望，即使她对我买衣服持无所谓的态度，我似乎是在占用她可能用于其他事情的钱。而且，我对花600美元买一件衬衫感到尴尬，不想让她知道。这些感觉源于我贫穷的成长经历，这种感觉永远不会消失，就像其他任何人可能有的家庭问题一样，只能努力去管理它。
Yeah. I like what you said about I used to feel that I was taking away from her. Yeah. And what I see in the way you talk about it and how curious you are, because we text about this stuff a lot is it feels to me now you are actually adding to your own curiosity. Of course, your family finances should be dialed in. Of course, you should have all your ratios working and your money flowing. Of course. But we should remember that two partners have got to be intellectually fulfilled. It makes them better partners. And as long as you're managing your joint money, you should be spending on your own.
好的。我喜欢你之前说的我曾经觉得自己是在从她那里拿走一些东西。我注意到，现在通过你讲述这些事情的方式以及你对此充满好奇的态度，我觉得实际上你是在增加自己的好奇心。当然，你们的家庭财务应该井井有条，你应该确保所有的收支比例合理、资金流动顺畅。这些都是理所当然的。但我们也应该记住，两人都需要有智力上的满足，这会让他们成为更好的伴侣。只要你们合理管理共同的资金，你们就应该在自己身上花一些钱。
One of the worst things I see this happens a lot with men is men become shells of who they used to be. So you talk to a guy in their 20s, they have all these hobbies and interests. You talk to them by their 50s and I go, what do you like to spend money on? They go, whatever my wife does, I go, we're not doing that here. Answer my question. What do you like to spend money on? And a lot of times they've lost all hobbies. I see that in myself. I have to fight to try to find some new hobbies because if it were just up to me, I would simply shrink myself. And so this happens to happens to a lot of people, but especially men. And I want to encourage us to try to fight against that.
我注意到一个很常见的现象，特别是在男性身上，就是他们会变成曾经的自己的一个空壳。在他们20多岁的时候，可能有很多兴趣和爱好。等到50多岁再问他们喜欢把钱花在哪里，他们常常会说，"随我老婆的意思。" 我就会说，不要这样说，回答我的问题：你自己喜欢把钱花在哪里？很多时候，他们已经失去了所有的爱好。我自己也有这样的感觉，我必须努力去寻找一些新的爱好，因为如果由着我自己，我可能就会逐渐缩小自己的生活圈子。这种情况对很多人都会发生，尤其是男性。我想鼓励大家努力去抵抗这种趋势。
When I was kind of up and coming in my entrepreneurial journey, I used to make fun of like, like self development people. What you, you fall in that category. And so do I. I'm going to stop crying right now. Well, no, but like, I would make one of you, but like, just the idea of like, people would be like, I'm hiring like an executive coach or I'm hiring a coach. I'm like, what? Like, man up. What are you doing? And then I, and then I started like, hiring a fitness coach and then a nutrition, a nutritionist. And by the way, a fitness coach could be like as cheap as like 50 or $100 a month with like future, one of these things. But basically just someone to like answer questions. And then also just tell me what to do.
在我刚开始创业的时候，我常常拿那些自我提升的人开玩笑。你也是这样的人，而现在我也是。但我现在停下不再嘲笑他们了。当时，我会嘲笑那些说要请执行教练或者其他教练的人，心想：“你干嘛不自己努力呢？这有什么好请教练的？”然而，后来我自己也开始请健身教练和营养师。顺便说一下，健身教练的费用可以低至每月50或100美元，比如通过一些平台。基本上，他们的作用就是回答我的问题，并告诉我该做些什么。
And I started doing that for so many different things. So I did for it starts with fitness, because that's the easiest application. But then you're like, we actually hired a home organization expert to come up and like teach us. And I'm like, dude, this is so much better way of learning to like read a book and also like, you know, the book, YouTube, whatever, all that stuff, take it to general knowledge, but then have an expert come in and pay them money. Yeah, it could be a small sum. Like you could, you could do a lot of the shit for a hundred bucks, like a cooking class or something like really simple and group on if you really wanted to. But like simple coaches to come and to teach you, but then the best situation is like, sometimes ongoing like class, do you know what I mean? It's like the greatest way to learn.
我开始在很多不同的事情上这样做。最开始是从健身入手，因为这是最容易应用的。然后我们甚至请了一位家庭整理专家来教我们。我意识到，这种学习方式远比读书或者看YouTube视频等要好。这些材料可以增加一般知识，但请一个专家来，并支付一些费用会更有帮助。费用可能很小，比如做一些简单的事情只需一百美元，比如一堂烹饪课或者其他你想学的简单技能，一些团购课程也可以。这种简单的辅导能够很好地帮助你学习。最理想的情况是，参加一些持续的课程。你懂我的意思吗？这真是学习的最佳方式。
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I love that you said that. I also love that you said, I used to say man up, because just think about what's embedded in that phrase, right? That suffering is masculine and that if something is hard, it is therefore more valuable. I think there's some truth to some of that, but I also think that yeah, yeah, like there's great grits reel. Yeah. I agree. And I think that sometimes we make things too easy for ourselves. And there is value in a challenge. But I also think that there's no prize given for living a smaller life than you have to. So I really want to inspire people to think about the things that you are interested in. There's probably somebody who can help you enjoy it more.
我喜欢你提到的观点。我也喜欢你说过去会用“man up”这个词，因为想想这个短语中包含的意思：痛苦是男性化的，如果某件事情很难，那么它就更有价值。我觉得其中有一些道理，但同时也认为，是的，有时候也要坚韧。我同意，有时候我们对自己太放松，挑战是有价值的。不过，我也认为没有必要过上比你需要的更局限的生活。所以，我真的想激励大家去思考你感兴趣的事情。可能有一些人可以帮助你更好地享受它。
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I talked to a guy in the fire community and he was like, I just don't really like to spend money. Like I'm good. So I asked him, like, what do you like? And you gave me these generic answers. So I probe, I really like to ask, tell me more. He goes, I love coffee. And he goes, I buy these beans. Okay. And he's like, that's that was the limit of what he thought he could do. I said, Hey, what if you hired a barista to come to your house and teach you how to make your coffee in even better? It never occurred to him. And I love that he was receptive. He later went on to do that. Imagine that. That's a hundred bucks, 200 bucks. Incredible.
我和一位消防界的人聊过，他说自己不太喜欢花钱，觉得自己过得挺好。我问他喜欢什么，他给了些很泛泛的答案。于是我继续追问，希望他说得更具体一些。他说，他喜欢咖啡，而且会买咖啡豆。对于他来说，这似乎就是他能做的极限了。我建议他，请个咖啡师到家里来，教他如何把咖啡做得更好，令他感到很意外的是，他从没考虑过这个想法。我很高兴他很乐于接受这项建议，后来他也真的去尝试了。想想看，花个一两百美元，就有这样的收获，太不可思议了。
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I had a book that I read about posture. I was like, I don't understand these freaking diagrams. How much I don't get it. So I hired them to come to my apartment and teach me how to improve my posture. That posture coach was transformative for me. It didn't work. This that worked. Dude, it changed my life. When we think about posture, I had something that was going on. Like when I would stand, I would find myself crossing my legs. It became uncomfortable on my back. And I'm like, this is weird. I'm like a young guy. Why? And I finally going from problem orientation to solution orientation is like a major shift. We can complain about stuff all day long, but there's a certain point where some people go, I want to fix.
段落三：我曾经读过一本关于姿势的书。我当时觉得：“我完全看不懂这些该死的图解。”我对自己的理解程度感到困惑。所以我请了一位姿势教练到我家来教我如何改善我的姿势。这个姿势教练对我来说意义重大，虽然牵强，它确实起作用了。伙计，它改变了我的生活。说到姿势，我曾经有个问题：站立时，我总是不由自主地交叉双腿，结果让我的背感到不适。我纳闷地想，这真奇怪，我还年轻，为什么会这样？最终，我意识到从关注问题转向关注解决方案是一种重大的转变。我们可以整天抱怨各种事情，但到了一定程度，有些人会说：“我想解决这个问题。”
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I found her. She came to my house. The first thing that happened when I opened the door, she looked at me and she was like shocked. But she's like, what? And I was like, hey, why are you looking at me like that? And she said something to the equivalent of her average client is like 75 years old. And I was in my late 30s at the time. And I said, look, I've got a little weird thing, but really this is prevented. I want to learn how to be better at this before I have problems. And that is the dream of any coach is for somebody who comes to you before they have major problems proactively. We worked together, I think six or nine times. She taught me it's postures, not just about putting your shoulders back. It starts from your feet and your knees and your glutes. The way I walk, she videotaped me walking and changed that. And the pain, there's no pain there. But more importantly, I can understand how the body works a little bit better than I used. To rat to the last question I want to wrap up, this is funny that you put this on this doc that we had, but someone messaged me. He's a good friend of mine. And I love him to death. So I'm making fun of him. But I love him. He was like, I want to come in and talk about credit card hacks. And I was like, you know, like ways that you could save, like get like 5% cash back and shit like that. And I'm like, I get why you you like that. And like, sometimes that's always fun to geek out on like cool puzzles and whatever. But like, that's not needle moving to me or to a lot of people.
第4段：我找到了她。她来到我家。开门的第一件事，她看到我后非常震惊。但她说，怎么会这样？我问她，为什么这样看我？她说她的平均客户大约75岁，而我当时才三十多岁。我告诉她，我有一些小问题，但我想在问题严重之前学习如何改善。这是所有教练的梦想，希望有人在出现大问题前主动找他们。我想我们一起工作了大约六到九次。她教会我站姿不仅仅是把肩膀向后放，还要从双脚、膝盖和臀部开始。她录下了我走路的样子并帮助我进行了调整，现在没有痛苦。更重要的是，我对身体如何运作的理解比以前更好了。最后一个问题很搞笑，我一个好朋友给我发信息，他是我很好的朋友，我很爱他，所以我也在开他的玩笑。他说他想来谈谈信用卡的技巧，比如如何获得5%的现金返还之类的。我明白他为什么喜欢这个，有时这些小谜题很有意思，但对我或很多人来说，这并不是改变生活重要的事情。
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Like I don't give a shit about like, you know, 2% cash back because that means I got to have like 10 credit cards and that's like fucking complicated. It's like, just to make $1,000, it's like, I'm going to spend like 10 hours on this. I'm probably going to forget the pay. Like it just, this is a fucking nightmare. And you have on here, you're like, fight for simplicity. The more successful you get, the more you have to fight for simplicity. I have found that to be true. And this is definitely a champagne problem. But I just like, some things get as you get a little make a little bit more money. Like you start thinking like, well, everyone else has a wealth advisor or everyone else is doing this or people, everyone else is investing in PE. Should we like do these things? Should we do that? And what's funny is like, maybe there's some other level. I'm sure there is like, when you're worth hundreds or billions of dollars where it's like, yeah, like you actually do need to be a little complicated. But for the most part, for most everyone listening, simplicity is the answer, I think. Is that right? I think so.
翻译：
我其实不太在乎所谓的2%的现金返还，因为这意味着我得拥有10张信用卡，这实在是太复杂了。为了赚到1000美元，我得花10个小时在这上面。我可能还会忘记付款。这简直就是个噩梦。你提到要追求简单化。成功越多，你就越要努力保持生活简单。我发现这是真的。这虽然是个“幸福的烦恼”，但当你赚的钱多一点后，有些事情就开始让你开始想，别人都有理财顾问，或是别人都在做这个，或是投资私募股权。我们是不是也应该做这些呢？有趣的是，也许在某个程度上，比如当你身价达到几亿甚至几十亿美元时，确实需要一些复杂的安排。但对大多数听众来说，我认为简单才是答案。这说得对吗？我觉得是的。
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I understand why when you're up and coming and young, it's fun to do credit card hacking. I get it. And it's fun to just learn new skills. I get that. But I have found that it's very difficult to turn off the grind mindset and to become much more calm and run things like a CEO, not a hustler. I find this is true a lot with personal finance people. I know people who are worth a lot of money and they still do credit card hacks. And if we look at how much they make, it's a negligible amount. Like I do it because I cannot turn the page on what got me here. And I don't realize that what got me here won't get me to the next level. So part of fighting for simplicity is that as you advance up, whether it be financially, relationally, etc., there are things that you simply cannot afford to do anymore.
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我明白，当你年轻并开始崭露头角时，进行信用卡“黑客”活动会很有趣。我能理解这点。而且学习新技能本身也是一种乐趣。我理解这些。但是，我发现很难从那种拼命奋斗的心态中走出来，变得更加冷静，从一个像首席执行官的角度来运营事情，而不是一个整天忙碌的人。我发现，个人理财方面的人常常有这样的状况。我认识许多资产丰厚的人，他们仍然在进行信用卡“黑客”活动。如果看看他们的收入，这种活动带来的收益微乎其微。他们之所以这样做，是因为无法放下曾经让他们成功的方式，却没有意识到这种方式并不能带他们到达更高的层次。所以，当你在财务上、人际关系上等取得进步时，为了追求简单化，有些事情是你再也无法继续做的。
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So I would not afford to be able to open up 10 new credit cards to save a total of $1,800 per year. That does not compute for what I'm trying to save and invest in my time. So that's very important to know, as you advance, you've probably got to stop doing certain things that got you here and think about what is the new chapter of my life. You're the man. Thank you for doing this. Thanks, Sam. Always a pleasure, man. When's the book officially out? The book is officially out January 1st. Oh, sick. All right. Two or three days. Thank you for doing this. You're the man. We appreciate you. I feel like I can rule the world. I know I could be what I want to. I put my law in it like a day's on. On a road, let's travel. Never looking back. Hey, Sean here.
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所以我不会去开10张新信用卡来每年省下总共1800美元。这不符合我试图节省和投资时间的目标。因此，了解这一点非常重要，当你取得进步时，你可能需要停止做一些让你走到这一步的事情，并考虑人生的新篇章。你真是个人物。感谢你做这一切。谢谢你，Sam。一直很高兴能和你合作。书什么时候正式发布？书将于1月1日正式发布。哦，太好了。两三天以后。感谢你做这一切。你真是个人物。我们很感激你。我觉得我可以主宰世界，我知道我可以成为我想成为的样子。我全心投入，就像每天都是新的开始。在少有人走的路上，从不回头。嗨，我是Sean。
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I want to take a minute to tell you a David Ogilvy story. One of the great ad men. He said, remember, the consumer is not a moron. She's your wife. You wouldn't lie to your own wife. So don't lie to mine. And I love that. You guys, you're my family. You're like my wife and I won't lie to you either. So I'll tell you the truth for every company I own right now. Six companies. I use Mercury for all of them. So I'm proud to partner with Mercury because I use it for all of my banking needs across my personal account, my business accounts. And anytime I start a new company, this is my first move, I go open up a Mercury account. I'm very confident in recommending it because I actually use it. I've used it for years. It is the best product on the market. So if you want to be like me and 200,000 other ambitious founders, go to mercury.com and apply in minutes. And remember, Mercury is a financial technology company, not a bank banking services provided by Choice Financial Group and Evolve Bank and Trust members FDIC.
我想花点时间给你讲一个关于大卫·奥格威的故事。他是广告界的传奇人物之一。他说，要记住，消费者不是傻子。她就像你的妻子。你不会对自己的妻子撒谎。所以也不要对我的妻子撒谎。我非常喜欢他说的这句话。大家都是我的家人，就像我的妻子一样，所以我也不会对你们撒谎。因此，我会坦诚相告，我目前拥有的六家公司都在使用Mercury处理所有业务。所以我为能与Mercury合作感到自豪，因为我所有的银行需求，包括个人账户和公司账户，都依赖于它。每当我创建新公司时，我的第一步就是去开一个Mercury账户。我非常有信心推荐它，因为我确实在用它，我已经用了很多年。它是市场上最好的产品。所以如果你想和我以及其他20万有雄心的创业者一样，只需访问mercury.com，几分钟即可申请。请记住，Mercury是一家金融科技公司，不是银行，银行服务由Choice Financial Group和Evolve Bank and Trust提供，它们都是FDIC成员。
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All right, back to the episode.
好，现在回到这个片段。